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Apparently asexual heteroromantic and biromantic women don't want me.


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#1 GD1

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 01:00 PM

So I'm in my mid 20s, male and a hetero-romantic ace. I have known 4 asexual women in my life. Out of them, 1 was homo-romantic, and 1 was biromantic and 2 were hetero-romantic. At some point while they were single, I asked out the bi-romantic and hetero-romantic girls. All three of them rejected me. They were all in their 20s at the time. In all three cases they ended up getting with pretty boy type guys shortly after. You know, small nose, pretty eyes, short face, generally smaller and softer facial features, full heads of hair, etc. Then I realized that they always seem to go for these types of guys. Every guy any of these three women dated literally looked and dressed like a boy band member.

This is quite the opposite of what I look like. I have a large nose, long face, square jaw, I'm balding, and I have thick dark facial hair that you can see pretty clearly as little as 4 hours after I shave cleanly. I couldn't pull off the whole emo/boy band/k-pop look no matter how hard I tried. :(

Of course they all say that personality is all they care about, but this pattern can't all just be one big coincidence. Maybe they were lying to me or maybe they're just subconsciously attracted to these types of guys. Most of the guys were not even asexual. Feels like a real kick in the teeth.

#2 Great Thief Yatagarasu

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 01:50 PM

...Or it could just be that they think you're a lovely person, but they just didn't happen to reciprocate your feelings? Over the past few days, I wrote a love letter to a female friend of mine (I'm a girl and I'm making steps to come out as bisexual, but she's a lesbian), and we had a talk yesterday about how she didn't reciprocate my feelings, but she still wanted to be friends. And as she pretty much said to me that she thinks I'm a lovely person and that I'm highly attractive in a physical sense. She just didn't happen to reciprocate my feelings, and blaming her for that just feels nasty and wrong to me - it's no one's fault that she doesn't. So getting angry at them for not fancying you comes across as being really bitter and angry at something that they couldn't help.

Also, you seem angry that they had a certain "type" - I'm sorry, but some people just DO have "types" that they tend to like more. And when I say that, I don't mean purely looks based. I, for example, tend to like nerdy people, and that's something that spans across men and women...I also happen to like androgyny, because to me, that denotes a certain honesty, bravery and comfort in themselves that I appreciate (because with guys and some girls, it's really difficult for them to look androgynous without people complaining about it). Does this make me shallow, or cruel towards the people who aren't "my type"? Of course not. But I like what I like, and I'd hate the idea of people trying to convince me that I should like something that maybe I don't.

Furthermore, there's more than one kind of attraction. I can get all warm and fuzzy feelings for people without wanting to shag them. I can also look at people and think "Jesus, that person's good looking as hell" without wanting to shag them. So it's highly likely that they ARE attracted to these boys, just not in a sexual way.

In addition, sexual/asexual relationships can and do happen (it's hard not to, seeing as asexual people are quite hard to find - most prospective partners for an asexual are likely to be sexual, purely going by statistics). They can also work very well. Obviously, they have difficulties that asexual/asexual relationships and sexual/sexual relationships wouldn't have, but that doesn't make the relationship worse, less valid or impossible to navigate.

Lastly, this is NOT what all asexual women are like. You're coming across as highly bitter and angry at these girls, purely because they failed to be interested in you - the feeling is understandable, but you're drawing some very unfair conclusions from it. Just because a girl could in theory be attracted to you doesn't mean that they absolutely should be and that they're terrible people if they aren't. I mean, the girl I like is a lesbian, and plenty of the guys I've liked were either straight or bi - should I go on rants about how "lesbians clearly don't want me because this specific lesbian didn't want me"? Nope, because that's unfair to her and it shows a highly entitled view on who people "should or shouldn't" like.
"I think for the most part I feel asexual, which is a kind like you are not completely attracted to either men or women, is in between spaces which is almost as to be bisexual, because you don't have a real choice. I've been with men, of course, but I love women so much (and you can see it on stage) ...and that's what men think: "oh, this is what women do?" that doesn't make me a lesbian, it's just what happened. But at the same time there's a part that I don't like, and is to don't be on only one side, because it makes me confused. And often I watch all from the outside, and I watch all as it is fine, and I respect it." - Emilie Autumn

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#3 Blunderbuss

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 01:50 PM

Apparently you were not the type of these girls, for they afterwards all dated guys who looked your complete opposite. And no, not all people who say personality was all that mattered mean it. In fact, most of them don't. Welcome to the modern world.

#4 CBC.Radio.Girl

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 02:33 PM

Huh, okay... Well I don't have a huge preference one way or the other (I'm biromantic, grey-a-ish), and someone's personality would always win out over their looks (I know they apparently said that as well), but I can't say I'm at all into "pretty boy" types myself. I'm also not into super-masculine-macho-man's-man types either, though. Someone with a well-rounded and balanced personality and a friendly appearance appeals to me most. (My preferences are relatively the same for women as well... not too girly and not extremely masculine, both personality-wise and appearance-wise.) I know you said that your experiences can't just be a coincidence, but more likely than not, they are -- albeit unfortunate ones for you. Asexual/grey-a/demisexual people have all sorts of preferences, just like sexual people do.

Edit: Perhaps you're attracted to a certain type of women, who happen to be attracted to a certain type man (which, inconveniently, is not the type you happen to be).
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#5 GD1

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 02:42 PM

In addition, sexual/asexual relationships can and do happen (it's hard not to, seeing as asexual people are quite hard to find - most prospective partners for an asexual are likely to be sexual, purely going by statistics).


Yes, and this in addition to the fact that by most accounts, asexual women outnumber asexual men something like 4 to 1. Going by logistics alone, you would think that would make me in high demand with asexual women, but that does not seem to be the case.






Lastly, this is NOT what all asexual women are like. You're coming across as highly bitter and angry at these girls, purely because they failed to be interested in you - the feeling is understandable,


I'm not angry at the women at all, I'm angry about the situation. It just hurts that asexual women (two of whom I had a lot in common with) didn't want me.

As for not all asexual women having this preference, I never said that all of them did, but this does seem to be a pattern. I talk to two other asexual girls online (they both live in other countries and I never met them so I didn't count them in my original post) both are hetero-romantic. I asked both of them to show me pics of guys they are attracted to, and both of them showed me nothing but feminine, cutsy, metrosexual pretty boys. So thats 5 out of 5 asexual hetro/bi romantic women that I know (online and offline) who prefer pretty boys, exclusively. Pretty boys are also a minority, so this is too much to be all a coincidence. Am I saying that 100 percent of all asexual women who are bi or hetero-romantic only want pretty boys? No. Sorry if it sounded that way. But what I am saying is that they are more likely to prefer pretty boys. Maybe I should have worded things better.

Yeah, I know I seem bitter, but I'm just really frustrated. I'm not a pretty boy. I don't look like a boy band member, korean pop singer, rpg character, or teen heartthrob. Instead, I'm masculine and balding. I did not choose this, but this fact prevented me of getting with the girl of my dreams. Worst of all, nothing I can do will make me resemble anything close to that. If there was something that could, I would do it, no matter how hard it was, but if I tried to dress and act the role it would only look ridiculous.

And like you said, its hard to meet aseuxal people. So hopefully you can understand my frustration.

#6 POURRITURE

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 02:50 PM

Slow down there nice guy.
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#7 Hobbes!

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 02:53 PM

I understand your frustration, and hey, this is the place to rant a bit without being completely rational. The banalities of attraction, and well, dating in general can be terribly irritating. I've felt bitter myself more than once towards people who haven't really deserved it (All I'm going to say is, damn ex-boyfriends everywhere)

Yes, and this in addition to the fact that by most accounts, asexual women outnumber asexual men something like 4 to 1. Going by logistics alone, you would think that would make me in high demand with asexual women, but that does not seem to be the case.



Friendly advice? Don't try and rationalise it. It'll drive you nuts

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#8 Blunderbuss

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 04:00 PM

In addition, sexual/asexual relationships can and do happen (it's hard not to, seeing as asexual people are quite hard to find - most prospective partners for an asexual are likely to be sexual, purely going by statistics).


Yes, and this in addition to the fact that by most accounts, asexual women outnumber asexual men something like 4 to 1. Going by logistics alone, you would think that would make me in high demand with asexual women, but that does not seem to be the case.


Sorry, but just because we are statistically more in number than male asexuals, won't make me run after you.

#9 starrynight

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 08:24 PM


Yes, and this in addition to the fact that by most accounts, asexual women outnumber asexual men something like 4 to 1. Going by logistics alone, you would think that would make me in high demand with asexual women, but that does not seem to be the case.


Sorry, but just because we are statistically more in number than male asexuals, won't make me run after you.

Right. First of all, the statistics may or may not be accurate, given that asexual visibility and research still have a long way to go; secondly, compatible sexuality isn't the only thing that matters, and some asexuals have no problem dating sexuals, so they don't have to only look for asexual partners; thirdly, heteroromantics don't seem to be the dominant group among asexuals.

Anyway, OP, I still think what you experienced is largely coincidence. From what I've read on AVEN, many asexuals (both men and women) don't have a physical "type" at all. They can grow to be attracted to pretty much any type (as long as not extremely ugly or unhealthy), if they're attracted to someone's mind and personality first. You just need to be patient and don't give up hope.
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#10 Great Thief Yatagarasu

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 11:12 PM

Yes, and this in addition to the fact that by most accounts, asexual women outnumber asexual men something like 4 to 1. Going by logistics alone, you would think that would make me in high demand with asexual women, but that does not seem to be the case.


Again, you're coming across as if you feel entitled to these women - being asexual yourself does not suddenly make you more attractive to them, nor does it mean that they SHOULD like you.

I'm not angry at the women at all, I'm angry about the situation. It just hurts that asexual women (two of whom I had a lot in common with) didn't want me.

As for not all asexual women having this preference, I never said that all of them did, but this does seem to be a pattern. I talk to two other asexual girls online (they both live in other countries and I never met them so I didn't count them in my original post) both are hetero-romantic. I asked both of them to show me pics of guys they are attracted to, and both of them showed me nothing but feminine, cutsy, metrosexual pretty boys. So thats 5 out of 5 asexual hetro/bi romantic women that I know (online and offline) who prefer pretty boys, exclusively. Pretty boys are also a minority, so this is too much to be all a coincidence. Am I saying that 100 percent of all asexual women who are bi or hetero-romantic only want pretty boys? No. Sorry if it sounded that way. But what I am saying is that they are more likely to prefer pretty boys. Maybe I should have worded things better.

Yeah, I know I seem bitter, but I'm just really frustrated. I'm not a pretty boy. I don't look like a boy band member, korean pop singer, rpg character, or teen heartthrob. Instead, I'm masculine and balding. I did not choose this, but this fact prevented me of getting with the girl of my dreams. Worst of all, nothing I can do will make me resemble anything close to that. If there was something that could, I would do it, no matter how hard it was, but if I tried to dress and act the role it would only look ridiculous.

And like you said, its hard to meet aseuxal people. So hopefully you can understand my frustration.


Settle down, nice guy. You don't SEEM bitter, you ARE bitter. So five people you know happened to prefer pretty boys - big fucking deal. Why are you so angry at them for it? Also, five people is still a very small sample size for you to use for the claim of "asexual women are more likely to prefer pretty boys." If you had a sample size of, say, a thousand, and the results were 90% affirmative that they liked pretty boys, THEN I'd believe you. Five random women who you know does NOT represent asexual women as a whole, and you're still generalising a lot.

Your looks didn't stop you from getting the girl of your dreams (and if it did, then was she really worth it?), your personality did. No offence, but if I met a guy and he started saying "It's not fair! These asexual women preferred pretty boys over me - I bet they're secretly sexually attracted to them or something! And their boyfriends aren't even asexual - how shallow are they for not going after ME?", which is pretty much what you've been doing, then I wouldn't want to date him either.

Summing up - you're blaming your lack of a love life on the fact that you don't look "pretty", and you're lashing out by blaming them for MAYBE preferring a certain kind of guy rather than face up to the fact that maybe your personality is the problem rather than your looks. I hate to be cruel in saying that, but that's the truth right there. You're blaming everything on your looks (which you can't control, therefore you're not to blame) and their tastes (which again deflects the blame off of you - and directly onto them) as the reasons as to why people don't fall at your feet, and honestly? It's horrible to read.
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"I think for the most part I feel asexual, which is a kind like you are not completely attracted to either men or women, is in between spaces which is almost as to be bisexual, because you don't have a real choice. I've been with men, of course, but I love women so much (and you can see it on stage) ...and that's what men think: "oh, this is what women do?" that doesn't make me a lesbian, it's just what happened. But at the same time there's a part that I don't like, and is to don't be on only one side, because it makes me confused. And often I watch all from the outside, and I watch all as it is fine, and I respect it." - Emilie Autumn

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#11 Qutenkuddly

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 12:18 AM

There is a substantial difference between someone feeling frustrated that he doesn't fit the bill for what most female folk in his peer group seem to appreciate and someone getting upset because his tokens of affection aren't getting the emotional/sexual response he expects. I actually understand his frustration because, from what I've seen, his observations are not unwarranted; a very large portion of the AVEN population, not just women, seem to show greater aesthetic appreciation for people who are more androgynous in appearance. One can see it in comments made under polls related to the topic, as well as which photos seem to draw the most positive interest in the Photo Threads. (Having said, I know for a fact that this is not universal; as a ruggedly built person who, for a substantial period of time, was the beardliest AVENite, I've received a fair bit of romantic interest. That involves getting out and talking to people, letting them get to know you.)

With that said, I ask that we refrain from a) assuming what someone else is thinking/feeling in spite of their attempts to clarify and explain their thoughts and, more importantly, b) throwing in Tumblr-esque meme stereotypes. Using the expression 'nice guy' as it has been here is very clearly derogatory and violates the ToS as any other personal insult would. As such, its continued use in this fashion will NOT be tolerated.

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#12 Ellii

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 01:48 AM

Aesthetic attraction may have played a role in their disinterest or maybe they just didn't like you that way. Either way, as frustrating as it may be, I cant see any good in getting so angry about it. Everyone looking for a relationship will have csses where their feelings aren't reciprocated. Your attitued in your post is certainly not one I can imagine many finding indicitive of an attractive personality. Maybe you just needed to vent, but if thats the case, you should probably rant and then go back and read it with the mindset of "people are going to read this" and clarify or edit as nessecary.
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#13 Qutenkuddly

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 02:01 AM

Again, please do not tell people what they think or feel.

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#14 Great Thief Yatagarasu

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 02:16 AM

There is a substantial difference between someone feeling frustrated that he doesn't fit the bill for what most female folk in his peer group seem to appreciate and someone getting upset because his tokens of affection aren't getting the emotional/sexual response he expects. I actually understand his frustration because, from what I've seen, his observations are not unwarranted; a very large portion of the AVEN population, not just women, seem to show greater aesthetic appreciation for people who are more androgynous in appearance. One can see it in comments made under polls related to the topic, as well as which photos seem to draw the most positive interest in the Photo Threads. (Having said, I know for a fact that this is not universal; as a ruggedly built person who, for a substantial period of time, was the beardliest AVENite, I've received a fair bit of romantic interest. That involves getting out and talking to people, letting them get to know you.)

With that said, I ask that we refrain from a) assuming what someone else is thinking/feeling in spite of their attempts to clarify and explain their thoughts and, more importantly, b) throwing in Tumblr-esque meme stereotypes. Using the expression 'nice guy' as it has been here is very clearly derogatory and violates the ToS as any other personal insult would. As such, its continued use in this fashion will NOT be tolerated.

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I understand, and I do apologise. The thing is, in the original post, there is a line there about "Maybe they were lying to me," and the general tone of it is very bitter and blameful towards these girls. We can't control how other people feel about us, so to go on a massive rant about how they happened to pick other people over him, especially since he gives reasons as to why they SHOULD have picked him over them and seems to think that these guys were picked purely for their looks...it just seems in really bad taste to me. And the fact that, justified or not, he's generalising something massive about biromantic and heteroromantic women as a whole...that's in bad taste too. I've had guys treat me this way before, and I had an ex-friend outright tell me that I was totally undesirable and unlovable because I'd come out to him as asexual, with this idea of entitlement likely being the cause of his behaviour - so I'm rarely if ever sympathetic towards people who behave like this.
"I think for the most part I feel asexual, which is a kind like you are not completely attracted to either men or women, is in between spaces which is almost as to be bisexual, because you don't have a real choice. I've been with men, of course, but I love women so much (and you can see it on stage) ...and that's what men think: "oh, this is what women do?" that doesn't make me a lesbian, it's just what happened. But at the same time there's a part that I don't like, and is to don't be on only one side, because it makes me confused. And often I watch all from the outside, and I watch all as it is fine, and I respect it." - Emilie Autumn

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#15 Qutenkuddly

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 03:16 AM


There is a substantial difference between someone feeling frustrated that he doesn't fit the bill for what most female folk in his peer group seem to appreciate and someone getting upset because his tokens of affection aren't getting the emotional/sexual response he expects. I actually understand his frustration because, from what I've seen, his observations are not unwarranted; a very large portion of the AVEN population, not just women, seem to show greater aesthetic appreciation for people who are more androgynous in appearance. One can see it in comments made under polls related to the topic, as well as which photos seem to draw the most positive interest in the Photo Threads. (Having said, I know for a fact that this is not universal; as a ruggedly built person who, for a substantial period of time, was the beardliest AVENite, I've received a fair bit of romantic interest. That involves getting out and talking to people, letting them get to know you.)

With that said, I ask that we refrain from a) assuming what someone else is thinking/feeling in spite of their attempts to clarify and explain their thoughts and, more importantly, b) throwing in Tumblr-esque meme stereotypes. Using the expression 'nice guy' as it has been here is very clearly derogatory and violates the ToS as any other personal insult would. As such, its continued use in this fashion will NOT be tolerated.

Qutenkuddly,
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I understand, and I do apologise. The thing is, in the original post, there is a line there about "Maybe they were lying to me," and the general tone of it is very bitter and blameful towards these girls. We can't control how other people feel about us, so to go on a massive rant about how they happened to pick other people over him, especially since he gives reasons as to why they SHOULD have picked him over them and seems to think that these guys were picked purely for their looks...it just seems in really bad taste to me. And the fact that, justified or not, he's generalising something massive about biromantic and heteroromantic women as a whole...that's in bad taste too. I've had guys treat me this way before, and I had an ex-friend outright tell me that I was totally undesirable and unlovable because I'd come out to him as asexual, with this idea of entitlement likely being the cause of his behaviour - so I'm rarely if ever sympathetic towards people who behave like this.


I understand what you are saying, but the OP provided clarification that he was frustrated with the situation. I can understand that frustration, frankly. It's very difficult being a romantic asexual with such a very limited pool of possible romantic partners. Sometimes, that frustration can be a little overwhelming and hard to deal with. Where else to vent that frustration than here? Let's give the OP a little space, please.
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#16 JAKQ7111

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:00 AM

I've also had absolutely zero luck in the romance department as of late, and believe me, it is absolutely frustrating. It can make you think like there's something wrong with you/your actions that makes you repulsive to those people to whom you are attracted. Ranting can be a healthy way of releasing all of that pent-up frustration that can come from this heartbreak.

Now then, that being said, placing blame (on yourself or on these other aces) will do nobody any good, and can only make the situation worse, either by making you appear whiny and undeserving, or by lowering your self-esteem/making you unnecessarily despondent. The bottom line is- you can't control how other people feel, and blaming them for not liking you will get nobody anywhere, and neither will blaming yourself for something you didn't (at least knowingly) do.

If you want something badly enough, and you are willing to gather the courage to act, you will eventually find someone with whom you are compatible. Don't feel like you are destined for eternal loneliness just because you've struck out with a few people. Good luck, and stay strong (now I just need to take my own advice!)
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#17 Kangaraa

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:35 AM

I am a newly turned 30, asexual bi-romantic woman and I can safely say that apperances means little to me in the dating department. Sure, I can classify a guy as handsome, although he is different to how you desribed. I guess I would say I prefer more classically handsome men instead of 'cutsey'. I prefer my women to be cassically beautiful too, so I guess I'm just old fashion.

While I can't speak for others, I know personally that a lot of things come before the looks department. I've dating people I really wouldn't have classed as good looking if I past them on the street, but I loved their smile or their laugh or the way they made me laugh or just spending time together.

I can understand it's frustrating, I've met people before and formed crushes but been rejected. It's horrible and it's so easy to look back and think it is something wrong with me but it's not, it's just something that happens. It takes two people to form a relationship and there needs to be something between those two people for something to form.

One of the things I noticed in your post though was that you never mentioned how you felt about them? Did you ask them out purely because they were asexual? Or did you want them because of who they are and being asexual was a bonus?

They could have rejected your advances because they didn't feel like anything more was there. I know I've had friends who have put the moves on me but I shot them down because I never felt anything more than friendship. The people themselves were awesome and maybe under different circumstances, I would have considered.

#18 RageofAnath

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 05:21 AM

Yeah, <10 is a tiny tiny tiny sample size.

I think androgyny is pretty, and if you asked to link you someone I thought of as being very aesthetically appealing, yeah, I probably would link you some gender-bending girl/boy.

BUT my SO has a pretty intense goatee, a tall and broad/muscular (though untoned) body type, a very masculine face, and so on. There's just no possible way anyone could ever mistake them as female-bodied, even with long hair that reaches to their mid-back. So what does it matter what I think is the most aesthetically appealing? Clearly it didn't matter when I fell in love with my SO... and all my other SO's were unmistakeably masculine as well. The truth is that I loved them for who they were inside rather than their wrappings, and I doubt that I'm particularly unique.

Also that 4:1 ratio assumes that all 4 are heteroromantic and thus theoretically 'avaliable', even if not single at the time.

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#19 Great Thief Yatagarasu

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:06 PM



There is a substantial difference between someone feeling frustrated that he doesn't fit the bill for what most female folk in his peer group seem to appreciate and someone getting upset because his tokens of affection aren't getting the emotional/sexual response he expects. I actually understand his frustration because, from what I've seen, his observations are not unwarranted; a very large portion of the AVEN population, not just women, seem to show greater aesthetic appreciation for people who are more androgynous in appearance. One can see it in comments made under polls related to the topic, as well as which photos seem to draw the most positive interest in the Photo Threads. (Having said, I know for a fact that this is not universal; as a ruggedly built person who, for a substantial period of time, was the beardliest AVENite, I've received a fair bit of romantic interest. That involves getting out and talking to people, letting them get to know you.)

With that said, I ask that we refrain from a) assuming what someone else is thinking/feeling in spite of their attempts to clarify and explain their thoughts and, more importantly, b) throwing in Tumblr-esque meme stereotypes. Using the expression 'nice guy' as it has been here is very clearly derogatory and violates the ToS as any other personal insult would. As such, its continued use in this fashion will NOT be tolerated.

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I understand, and I do apologise. The thing is, in the original post, there is a line there about "Maybe they were lying to me," and the general tone of it is very bitter and blameful towards these girls. We can't control how other people feel about us, so to go on a massive rant about how they happened to pick other people over him, especially since he gives reasons as to why they SHOULD have picked him over them and seems to think that these guys were picked purely for their looks...it just seems in really bad taste to me. And the fact that, justified or not, he's generalising something massive about biromantic and heteroromantic women as a whole...that's in bad taste too. I've had guys treat me this way before, and I had an ex-friend outright tell me that I was totally undesirable and unlovable because I'd come out to him as asexual, with this idea of entitlement likely being the cause of his behaviour - so I'm rarely if ever sympathetic towards people who behave like this.


I understand what you are saying, but the OP provided clarification that he was frustrated with the situation. I can understand that frustration, frankly. It's very difficult being a romantic asexual with such a very limited pool of possible romantic partners. Sometimes, that frustration can be a little overwhelming and hard to deal with. Where else to vent that frustration than here? Let's give the OP a little space, please.


Well, I've been frustrated before too - I can't date asexuals in case I start feeling sexy things towards them, and I get stressed at the thought of dating sexuals just in case I DON'T get sexy things towards them. I get frustrated when I like someone and it's obvious they don't like me. I get terrified that I'll never meet someone who'd be able to put up with me and my AS long enough to like me - this extends to my friends, too. I totally understand how this guy feels, I really do. I've lived that, I've thought "What's so good about that girl that makes him like her over me?". I've done that.

Complaining that it's THEIR fault for not liking me, however, isn't the way I'd go about it, and it's a form of ranting that I have no time for. Maybe it's just because this argument on looks is slightly lost on me - I know I have a "type" of appearance that I'm more likely to see and go "Cor, what a fittie!", but when I fall in love with someone, no matter what they look like, they end up becoming handsome to me (to counteract the OP's example, most of the guys I've fancied or dated have actually been quite pudgy, with no real care for their personal appearances...and yet, to me, they're some of the handsomest bastards on the planet). I don't think that's an uncommon thing, either. Whatever it is, I just don't think it's fair of this guy to be so rude about these girls in retaliation. Frustrated or not, working through it by painting them in such a negative light does nothing for no one - all it does is make him come across as angry and bitter. I mean, can you imagine if one of the girls he's talking about ends up finding this? How offended and hurt do you think she'd be?

Not saying that we're all perfect and that none of us have ever done this at some point, and I'm not saying that his frustrations aren't understandable. I'm just wondering how likely it is that the girls he's talking about would be able to read this and piece together that it's written by this one guy they knew, is all.
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#20 Qutenkuddly

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:53 PM

Erm, I'm not quite sure that the OP is 'painting them in a negative light'. He's merely stating that the ones he's met seem more interested in a type of appearance that he is not able to achieve. Is it possible that you may be reading more into this on the assumption that the OP is demonstrating 'nice guy' tendencies?
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#21 Great Thief Yatagarasu

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 06:27 PM

Erm, I'm not quite sure that the OP is 'painting them in a negative light'. He's merely stating that the ones he's met seem more interested in a type of appearance that he is not able to achieve. Is it possible that you may be reading more into this on the assumption that the OP is demonstrating 'nice guy' tendencies?


It's the fact that these girls liking a specific type of look is apparently the only reason he can think of that they wouldn't go out with him. Of course, they COULD be that shallow...but then again, there are so many factors involved in choosing who you date that it's pretty simplistic to just say "They're dating a pretty boy, and I'm not a pretty boy - therefore, she's dating him because of his looks, and most asexual women are going to be similar." There was also that line about "maybe they were lying to me and were secretly attracted to them" which bothered me too.

I know that some people do accidentally slip into the "nice guy" thing without realising it - again, I've done it before - so I know what the red flashing warning lights are for this sort of thing. Not saying he IS a "nice guy," just that he could be if he's not careful. And if I'm "reading too deeply" into this, then it's because I'm a literature student and reading deeply into shit is what I do all day.
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#22 Miss Behavin'

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 04:00 AM

Well, to start out with, three is a very small sample size. I have made moves on maybe half a dozen ostensibly heterosexual men, and all six rejected me - later, one came out of the closet, one has still not shown the slightest interest in women, and the other four dated other women. However, I did not consider this to be sufficient evidence on which to base a conclusion that heterosexual men simply do not want me. In fact, if the experiences of my sexual friends who are trying to date by meeting people at social gatherings or places are any indication, it's not uncommon that advances towards three separate people will not result in any dates.

But there's also an additional aspect to gender identity that just doesn't go on a male-to-female spectrum, there's also gender expression which is what some people call "butch/femme", which means whether people present as more traditionally masculine or feminine variants of their identified gender. However, the words we have for romantic and sexual orientations (with the possible exceptions of a- or pan-) just usually separate things into genders, and don't account for gender expression. So there's also a possibility, IMO, that these hetero- and bi-romantic women, just as they're only attracted to a certain gender, are also only attracted to a certain gender expression, but they can't put it into words (either because it's not quite conscious, or they don't have the words, or they're OK with the closest approximation of their romantic orientation that people will widely understand).

Lastly, because gender and gender expression affect the way that one experiences the world, I wouldn't discount the possibility that these "pretty boys" who have a more feminine gender expression may actually tend to have a different personality than you.

#23 GD1

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 05:43 AM

Lastly, because gender and gender expression affect the way that one experiences the world, I wouldn't discount the possibility that these "pretty boys" who have a more feminine gender expression may actually tend to have a different personality than you.


I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "gender expression". I was mostly just talking about their facial features. Some of the guys these girls dated did have a somewhat feminine personality as well , but most just had "typical guy" personalities, not feminine, but not over the top macho. The only consistent variable is the fact that they had feminine and attractive faces.


I actually understand his frustration because, from what I've seen, his observations are not unwarranted; a very large portion of the AVEN population, not just women, seem to show greater aesthetic appreciation for people who are more androgynous in appearance. One can see it in comments made under polls related to the topic, as well as which photos seem to draw the most positive interest in the Photo Threads.


Yeah, I noticed that too when I lurked here for a bit, and that combined with the girls I know and the girls I talked to online solidified my theory.


With that said, I ask that we refrain from a) assuming what someone else is thinking/feeling in spite of their attempts to clarify and explain their thoughts



Thank you. Seems like some really just want to demonize me as much as possible.

and, more importantly, b) throwing in Tumblr-esque meme stereotypes. Using the expressi&#111;n 'nice guy' as it has been here is very clearly derogatory and violates the ToS as any other personal insult would. As such, its continued use in this fashion will NOT be tolerated.




Yeah, it was pretty obvious to me that the "nice guy" comments on here were just a passive aggressive, way of saying "F*** you a**hole". Also kinda messed up to kick a guy when he's down. Ah well, I don't think I'll stick around. You yourself seem like a chill bro, but there's too much over the top political correctness and hostility towards those who don't quite mesh with the super PC culture seen on places like reddit and tumblr. Thanks for sticking up for me though.

Cheers.

#24 Qutenkuddly

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 12:38 PM

Yeah, it was pretty obvious to me that the "nice guy" comments on here were just a passive aggressive, way of saying "F*** you a**hole". Also kinda messed up to kick a guy when he's down. Ah well, I don't think I'll stick around. You yourself seem like a chill bro, but there's too much over the top political correctness and hostility towards those who don't quite mesh with the super PC culture seen on places like reddit and tumblr. Thanks for sticking up for me though.


I'm sorry that you had such a discouraging experience here. The poor reception you received is not typical of AVEN behaviour and, as you can see from my actions here, officially discouraged. I do hope you will reconsider your decision to leave.
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#25 Hobbes!

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 02:15 PM


Yeah, it was pretty obvious to me that the "nice guy" comments on here were just a passive aggressive, way of saying "F*** you a**hole". Also kinda messed up to kick a guy when he's down. Ah well, I don't think I'll stick around. You yourself seem like a chill bro, but there's too much over the top political correctness and hostility towards those who don't quite mesh with the super PC culture seen on places like reddit and tumblr. Thanks for sticking up for me though.


I'm sorry that you had such a discouraging experience here. The poor reception you received is not typical of AVEN behaviour and, as you can see from my actions here, officially discouraged. I do hope you will reconsider your decision to leave.


Hate to be the devil's advocate here - because I don't want to discourage GD1 - but this response is pretty representative of a rant in Musirants. Despite the name, an irrational rant in the vein of the OP is guaranteed to be taken as a considered opinion
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#26 MadRat

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 02:50 PM

Asexual people have usually some aesthetic preferences and I noticed that a lot of asexual women are into feminine/androgynous guys who look like children or girls. I personally don´t get what is so attractive about those types. I like men who look like men. There are surely more asexual women with preferences similar to mine out there. :)
 
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#27 Philip027

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 03:08 PM

Yes, and this in addition to the fact that by most accounts, asexual women outnumber asexual men something like 4 to 1. Going by logistics alone, you would think that would make me in high demand with asexual women, but that does not seem to be the case.


Asexual people aren't going to think you're some kind of catch simply because you're also asexual... there's way more that goes into attraction/relationships/etc than that.

Edited by Qutenkuddly, 16 November 2012 - 03:50 PM.

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#28 Great Thief Yatagarasu

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 05:47 PM

Yeah, it was pretty obvious to me that the "nice guy" comments on here were just a passive aggressive, way of saying "F*** you a**hole". Also kinda messed up to kick a guy when he's down. Ah well, I don't think I'll stick around. You yourself seem like a chill bro, but there's too much over the top political correctness and hostility towards those who don't quite mesh with the super PC culture seen on places like reddit and tumblr. Thanks for sticking up for me though.

Cheers.


The thing about being on ANY website that has a forum - you're going to come across bitches and assholes that don't agree with you. I've been shredded to bits on this forum before - you just have to live and let live, which pretty much everyone here is willing to do. I've probably been offended by, and have offended, pretty much everyone on here. Every time, the "You've been a bitch, apologise" talk happens, and everything goes back to normal. It's how LIFE goes. Reason being, every internet forum is going to be full of flawed people who aren't going to be perfect all the time (or even some of the time).

Plus, as I've pointed out, even the people who think badly of your way of handling these rejections sympathise with you. Dude, I TOTALLY get it. I've been rejected by so many people I can barely count. But let's say I were the one writing this message - there's a difference between me going "I'm really upset right now, I feel like I've been rejected by a guy purely based on looks" (which is what you meant to say) and "I'm so upset, three straight guys that I liked started dating short brunette girls - that must mean that MOST straight guys like short brunettes, and as a tall blonde I feel like they're being unfair and shallow," (which is effectively what you put). There's nothing overly PC about disagreeing with you here. You're allowed to be upset, you're allowed to think life is unfair - but honestly, you don't know if these girls are even ON AVEN. If they're asexual, they might be. Would you really want them to read this, and hear exactly what you think of them and every other woman who identifies as a hetero/biromantic asexual woman?

So we get the sentiment. But generalising entire groups of people based on one or two people is pretty unfair (speaking as a biromantic girl - we're not a group of clones or something).

Also (and this might be a cultural thing), androgynous people of all kinds are usually thought of as attractive anyway, at least here in the UK. Pretty boys are fawned over by guys and girls alike, and the same goes for butch women. I don't know why, but I've seen a lot of people of varying genders and orientations say that they like androgynous people, for varying reasons. That doesn't mean that every other type of person is somehow not attractive.

As for AVEN and whether you want to stick around - it depends on if you're actually willing to give people a chance. I'd be perfectly happy to see you around. You want to leave, though? Go ahead. Just saying, though, that first impressions don't really count. I thought AVEN was absolutely perfect and absolutely nothing could go wrong here, originally. Then I got a reality check. The same goes for Tumblr, and deviantart, and Gaia Online, and pretty much every other website I've been to where people can converse. And it would be kinda silly of me to run away from all these places the second someone says a bad world to me.

Some people I've argued with, and they've not come back. Like that girl who spoke in purple prose and thought that cannibalism was totally okay if the person being eaten was consenting to it. Or the person who totally believed that gay asexuals should stay away from the gay community because they're somehow ruining everything for the "real" gay people. But you know, you aren't so bad as that.

Pretty much, I'm sure AVEN could have it's bright spots for you. You'd have to stick around and find out.

Edited by Qutenkuddly, 16 November 2012 - 09:10 PM.

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"I think for the most part I feel asexual, which is a kind like you are not completely attracted to either men or women, is in between spaces which is almost as to be bisexual, because you don't have a real choice. I've been with men, of course, but I love women so much (and you can see it on stage) ...and that's what men think: "oh, this is what women do?" that doesn't make me a lesbian, it's just what happened. But at the same time there's a part that I don't like, and is to don't be on only one side, because it makes me confused. And often I watch all from the outside, and I watch all as it is fine, and I respect it." - Emilie Autumn

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#29 Pyro Yoshi

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 06:55 PM

Asexual people have usually some aesthetic preferences and I noticed that a lot of asexual women are into feminine/androgynous guys who look like children or girls. I personally don´t get what is so attractive about those types. I like men who look like men. There are surely more asexual women with preferences similar to mine out there. :)


I've noticed this as well, and I don't really understand it either. I'm completely turned off by uber macho types who bleed pure testosterone, but I don't like super girly men either. Out of all the guys I've ever found attractive, be they classmates, co workers, random guys on the street, or celebrities, only one can be described as somewhat femine. In case you're wondering, that would be Frost from Satyricon. He has rather feminine facial features, but I still find him attractive because its very obvious to me that he's a man, not a woman.

So rest assured, not all asexual women like dainty pretty boys who look like real life versions of their favorite girly man anime characters.

#30 RageofAnath

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 07:03 PM

Plus, as I've pointed out, even the people who think badly of your way of handling these rejections sympathise with you. Dude, I TOTALLY get it. I've been rejected by so many people I can barely count. But let's say I were the one writing this message - there's a difference between me going "I'm really upset right now, I feel like I've been rejected by a guy purely based on looks" (which is what you meant to say) and "I'm so upset, three straight guys that I liked started dating short brunette girls - that must mean that MOST straight guys like short brunettes, and as a tall blonde I feel like they're being unfair and shallow," (which is effectively what you put). There's nothing overly PC about disagreeing with you here.



This is exactly what I got out of the original post, and I was about to write a response similar to this.
So yeah, x2 on the example here.

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