Neutrois / agender surgery?

[.Mari]

I've always assumed it was pretty much impossible to actually have a body without a sex, to my disappointment. But is that actually true, or is there surgery for it?

Is it one of those surgeries that costs millions and can only be found in three places in the world, or what?

[Rebuilder]

"Gender-nullification surgery" exists, and is brought up on Neutrois.com. I have read about M/FtN surgery on a couple of gender forums before, and apparently it's not extremely uncommon.

[CDSM]

It's probably not something you hear about too much because the dominating view is that there isn't such a thing as gender-neutral.

I guess it would also depend on what, exactly, you want to go for.

[Guest]

I've never heard of it existing anywhere; what I do know is that over here (Germany), surgery that leaves your body genderless/neutrois would be against the law. The only time removal of the reproductive tract/genitals would be legal here would be to do a trans OP adjustment to the other binary sex, thus including a full plastic construction of a neovagina or penoid; or if it's necessitated by an organic condition (e.g., testicular cancer). Not terribly fond of how law handles that here, but seeing how the Nazis were keen on forced sterilization of people who were "bad for the Aryan genepool", it's not too surprising to me that post-War Germany still has some strict legal backlash in regard of castration law (that's exactly how it's called here).

[CDSM]

I think it'd be nice to have a genderless body, but the idea of surgery and such freaks me out. I've been lucky so far I haven't needed surgery or other serious medical attention for any health problems, but I'm scared to death of it.

[Azure.Providence]

It would be exceedingly difficult to find a doctor willing to perform a full nullification surgery. I heard many years ago that a few doctors in Thailand would be willing but I am afraid the laws in that country have changed since then. In the United States its bad enough just to get castrated(without transitioning to a woman) as there are only like 3 doctors that I am aware of that will perform the procedure and you need letters stating you are sane and aware of whats going on. Pretty much unless you are transitioning or have some sort of genital cancer/infection doctors around the world are very unwilling to do too much with them.

[CDSM]

It would be exceedingly difficult to find a doctor willing to perform a full nullification surgery. I heard many years ago that a few doctors in Thailand would be willing but I am afraid the laws in that country have changed since then. In the United States its bad enough just to get castrated(without transitioning to a woman) as there are only like 3 doctors that I am aware of that will perform the procedure and you need letters stating you are sane and aware of whats going on. Pretty much unless you are transitioning or have some sort of genital cancer/infection doctors around the world are very unwilling to do too much with them.

Yeah, because you can't transition to a gender neutral position. It's not something that can fit in their worldview.

I wonder what other element might work into a nullification process though, apart from getting genitals removes (and, for a woman, how that might manifest as well, if they don't want female genitals). Like, a neutral equivalent of hormones and such.

It's a shame there's not more research into the area, but I suppose it'll naturally come once LBGT issues get more acceptance.

[JON]

It would be exceedingly difficult to find a doctor willing to perform a full nullification surgery. I heard many years ago that a few doctors in Thailand would be willing but I am afraid the laws in that country have changed since then. In the United States its bad enough just to get castrated(without transitioning to a woman) as there are only like 3 doctors that I am aware of that will perform the procedure and you need letters stating you are sane and aware of whats going on. Pretty much unless you are transitioning or have some sort of genital cancer/infection doctors around the world are very unwilling to do too much with them.

Yeah, because you can't transition to a gender neutral position. It's not something that can fit in their worldview.

I wonder what other element might work into a nullification process though, apart from getting genitals removes (and, for a woman, how that might manifest as well, if they don't want female genitals). Like, a neutral equivalent of hormones and such.

It's a shame there's not more research into the area, but I suppose it'll naturally come once LBGT issues get more acceptance.

I´m open about my feelings to this topic, when it comes to forums.Not public

What I annoys me is that therapist/surgeons is´nt represented on forums.On What´s Gender someone created a topic saying : Why don´t people believe in us ?

This is my reply :

Your transition as neutrois is just as personal as a TS/TG, and the psychological effects are the same.The "pain" is the same.

Could a compromise be that you after transition it was only possible to get hormones matching the gender you were ? And if you took your bloodtest and the results were within your range before transition.Would it then be a good idear to the get the hormones for free ?

All procedures are known so there's nothing new there.What could be another idear to make it more acceptable could that be to make some strict rules about how you would get the surgery.And how it was done.And all of the surgeries are done in pairs.Which means that each step are done on both genders.

DO NOT SEARCH FOR PICTURES, UNLESS YOU CAN HANDLE THAT KIND OF PICTURES

Step 1:

Sterilization, but still able to have sex :

Male : Orchiectomy

Female : Oophorectomy(ovaries) Hysterectomy(uterus)

Step 2 :

Topsurgery, making both genders look same at the top.Still able to have sex.

Male : Nipple removal

Females : Mastectomy.

Step 3 :

Bottomsurgery, sex is difficult, but can be done.

Male : Penectomy

Female : Radical vaginectomy

[Kolikeos]

While I am afraid of surgery because of the physical aspect, and am also frightened by the social aspects of nullifying my sex, I really really want the option to be available to me. I want to be sex less. Castration will do too. Even if I won't actually dare to really do it.

[.Mari]

I used to hate the idea of surgery (mainly because going under anesthetic doesn't sound fun - I haven't been unconcious before) but it's been driving me crazy lately. It's weird because I've met other agendered / neutrois people, but they don't seem to be having the same experience. Sometimes I just feel like I'm crazy or something and just have to put up with the fact that I'm female but... I don't know. It doesn't seem right.

I don't know what I'm supposed to do now.

[CDSM]

I guess it could be that surgery of this nature, even to relieve a dissatisfaction, is still essentially a mutilation of your natural body, and it could easily end up with something you don't want either, if something gets screwed up.

If you feel relatively comfortable now, in a way that you think you "can at least deal with it", it might seem better than risking ending up with something worse with no way out.

There's still a lot of ways you can't change your body. And there's no way to "test run" various body configurations to find out which you are most comfortable with.