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Rabger

To Sexual Partners

Recommended Posts

mkt

TinyT -- did you say you and your (now) husband have been together for 15 years? It seems you *have* been making your relationship work. It seems you are loathe to admit you may never change - and in truth, maybe you *will* always be apathetic about sex. It seems you are worried that once you admit that, your relationship will fall apart. On the one hand, I am a bit puzzled, because if you and your partner have managed 15 years, that's pretty darned successful - clearly there is so much more between you than sex, so it seems it would take a lot more than your asexuality to end the relationship.

On the second hand, I'll also suggest that you don't need to box yourself into any definition for all time. I've heard so many stories of individuals who used to be sexual becoming asexual and I don't see why it isn't possible for someone who isn't interested in sex to one day become (sincerely) sexual in some way. It doesn't seem to happen often, but it isn't impossible. Sexuality is very complex - don't box yourself in if you don't want to. You can't predict the future. It seems sexuality is mostly phsyiological/biological... it seems to be like temperment - people definitely are hard-wired for certain propensities - gay, fetish, asexual, whatever. But people also change a tiny bit every day - in how they move through the world, in how they develop their love and relationships, in what they learn, and sometimes in their sexuality. I'm not saying you *should* change, I'm simply suggesting you don't need to label yourself or define yourself. If you are fearful of admitting you are asexual, don't. Perhaps it is not a decision you have to make. Whether or not you and your husband want to finally give up on trying to "find yor buttons" may be a different issue...

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user1

Have any asexuals here, particularly women, tried testosterone supplementation? If so, what were the results?

(This is a serious inquiry, not a troll, thanks!)

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Lonely in Love

User1 ... I have discussed with my husband that perhaps he should see a doctor, maybe his testosterone levels are low or he depressed or something else.. and he always agrees that it is a good idea and he will make an appointment... but then never does.

We ordered the over-the-counter testosterone boosters for people who work-out to see if that might help, and he took them religiously for a week then stopped without telling me, allowing me to think he had been taking them still. That was a very big fight.

Part of my frustration is that I could accept it if he made an effort, but it really seems at times he doesn't care that I am unhappy. He feels like it is my problem and I should deal with it on my own (of course without masterbating anywhere near or around him and without looking elsewhere for sex).

I wonder if he's afraid that there is something wrong with him physically and so wants to avoid going to the doctor so that he will not have to find out sometimes.

Like I said before, this is extra confusing because, for a time, there were no problems sexually between us.

I have tried to get him to come here, read about this, but he is resistant to that, too. I have a lot of male friends, all of whom are convinced he is cheating on me because his behavior is so out of the norm, but I know he is not. There simply is not enough time or oppertunity for him to do so. He gets mad at me for talking about our private issues with my friends, and here as well, but I ask him what else am I supposed to do?

He won't do the things he has promised to do, he won't allow me to please myself, he has said he would leave if I took a lover, and now I am not supposed to talk about it either?

I almost wonder if he isn't punishing me, or trying to push me to leave him, though he claims he is not when I ask. Like I said, this is just a really messed up situation and I am at the end of my rope.

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Rabger
Have any asexuals here, particularly women, tried testosterone supplementation? If so, what were the results?

I would just like to point out that while doing so might result in a more active sex drive, this will not create the ability to experience sexual attraction. There are many people on this site that have active sxe drives and no sexual attraction. And some of us, men and women, have had our hormones tested only to find out that they are 100% normal. Furthermore, I'd like to caution anyone, particularly women, from taking testosterone supplements without talking to a doc first, as they can have nasty side effects (such as a sex drive).

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user1
Part of my frustration is that I could accept it if he made an effort, but it really seems at times he doesn't care that I am unhappy. He feels like it is my problem and I should deal with it on my own (of course without masterbating anywhere near or around him and without looking elsewhere for sex).

<snip>

He won't do the things he has promised to do, he won't allow me to please myself, he has said he would leave if I took a lover, and now I am not supposed to talk about it either?

I almost wonder if he isn't punishing me, or trying to push me to leave him, though he claims he is not when I ask. Like I said, this is just a really messed up situation and I am at the end of my rope.

That he won't allow you to masturbate is extremely disturbing, and controlling. I'm trying to get to sleep, so I won't address your whole note. I suggest pleasuring yourself out of his presence to take some of the edge off. No need to tell him, that's none of his business. Then try to get him into couples' counseling, so you can work on the relationship, or at least his need to control you.

If he won't do that, it'll be difficult. You might have to take some unilateral actions, suggest talking with a counsellor yourself to help you work out how you want to proceed.

My situation is similar, though my wife doesn't prohibit masturbation. She acts a bit put off by it, but knows there are limits.

Write with your progress, to be continued.

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mkt

I too have a partner who won't even take part in (just hold me while i pleasure myself, jst be present) or witness my masturbation - he wants no part of my sexuality at all, wants no sexual contact at all. AND says if I seek another lover we will be "just friends." I understand his emotional attachment to me means it would hurt him if I shared my sexuality with someone else. I truly believe he loves me.

I also know this is a recipe for twisting me up into a neurotic mess ... I've tried every thing possible - suggested every compromise I can think of, every variation and level of sexual contact, every way to address our sexual diferences (such as therapy) and am even willing to just leave him alone sexually if I can have sex elsewhere... all because I thought we had a great relationship and loved each other. and we did. we've had a wonderful life and have been great partners -- even sexually --- until he lost all interest in sex.

When one person has a shift in libido (as my partner did), or if one person's desire for sex is weaker (including non existent) than the others' it behooves the other person to be patient and accepting... At a certain point though, a couple has to work this kind of thing out together. A partner who resists all change and all solutions to a problem that is troubling his/her spouse verges on the edge of being abusive. I am in a position of minimal choices because my partner refuses to engage in any form of problem solving whatsoever. I can stay in a 100% sexless relationship, I can cheat and lie, or I can leave. I hate each of these options, but I think the healthiest one is to leave.

I try to find the humor in the situation, which is a bit tough... the funniest thing I can think of is that it takes two people to keep a sexual relationship creative and vital and keep it from getting stale and boring. I have the same old boring sex life every day and every night -- no sex. and my partner is not willing to help "spice it up" to please me, even though he knows his refusal is destroying us. ha ha ha. No one can work with a partner like that. the two goals are too different. he wants a totally asexual relationship that is monogamous (what a load of crap that is -- that relationship is only possible between two asexual people) and i want a relationship that includes sexuality. Oh well. it simply can't work. no matter how much we love each other and how well we get along otherwise.

Sorry to be so negative Lonely in love, but I relate to what you are saying and I hope my thoughts on my situation can help you form a plan of action for yourself. Life is too short to be unhappy.

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Rabger
he wants a totally asexual relationship that is monogamous (what a load of crap that is -- that relationship is only possible between two asexual people) and i want a relationship that includes sexuality

Actually, that's not impossible between a sexual/asexual couple. I've had sexual partners tell me about their agreement to take sexuality out of the relationship and still keep it monogomous. Though I do think each individual should compromise with each other, sometimes someone is willing to compromise with giving up sexual activity of any kind. It depends on how important it is to everyone. Not all sexual people believe its a necessity.

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ilse

I just joined and thought it nice to add a response here.

I was the partner of an asexual man. We are still best friends and we have tried to work out a relationship without sex. I have told only a few of my friends about this at that stage, I am telling everyone that is close to me now because for me that is part of closure on the relationship-level. We decided to break up, but that was generally his idea. We are now in the beginning stages of being best friends :D

But this topic is to see how couples like my 'ex' and I had a relationship, right?

* of course, we'd be strictly monogamous. Monogamous, and asexual. Because you can't have a healthy relationship including sex if one of the partners doesn't enjoy sex.

We have tried to do this, but the period I am speaking of (the period between him telling me about his non-interest in sex and the actual end of the relationship as such was only 6 weeks). If we'd still be an item with the perspective of living together or getting married I would work on a way to adjust to the prospect of having no sex. I only experienced having that prospect for a short while, and I found that a very difficult thought. I am moderator on another website (one about relationships and personal growth), and I was particularly assigned to the sex forums. I had to step back from that task for a while.

* people commonly ask me the following things that tell me they are far from understanding

1. he must be abused as a child (this is combined with a very concerned face)

2. he must be gay (read: one MUST have some sexual feelings :-? )

3. he should give it up and at least try to pleasure you once in a while (What? Do you think I enjoy sex with someone that doesn't enjoy sex?)

4. he should take hormones

5. did you go to a therapist with him

*sigh*

My answers:

1. as far as I know he has no history of abuse. He hasn't told me and I doubt that it would have this effect. He is not scared of being touched, he simply doesn't like to be touched at the places sexual people DO like to be touched.

2. he has no sexual desires for men, he says that if he would want sex, he'd be with a woman. He has always fallen in love (without the aspect of sex) with women. Well, in fact I am the second person he has been in love with and the first to have a serious relationship with.

3. Read the above, mostly I didn't respond to so much inconsideration of both his and my feelings.

4. Why would he?

5. read 4. There is nothing wrong with him, it is already clear that he doesn't experience sexual feelings, should we really invest $1000 in a therapist who tells us the same thing and probably leaves us both more confused than we ever were?

________

That was such a relief! :D :D

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the other one

I cannot tell you how grateful I am to find this sticky. I joined last year, searching for someone to talk to, but the site was then populated almost exclusively by asexuals. I came back on a whim, and discovered this thread for people like me.

A year on from finding out that my husband of 13 years is asexual, I am still struggling to come to terms with it. He is a fairly "classic" case - normal libido, able to have sex, gender oriented (definitely heterosexual), but simply lacking feelings of sexual attraction to women (I'm simplifying, but I just want to make it clear that this is just what he is, not a symptom of a medical problem). My difficulties with our sexual relationship lie in two areas. First, he cannot understand me. Second, our sexual relationship seems destined to be permanently unfulfilling for me - and this is where I struggle most.

Explaining sexual feelings to an asexual person feels like explaining colour to a blind person. He does not have a point of reference for understanding me. He finds talking about it upsetting, and I think that is partly because it is so hard for him to understand what I am talking about.

The second problem has two sides: the lack of sex, and the deficiencies of the sex we have. We rarely have sex - the longest gap was around a year and a half, and the current rate is around every 3-6 months. The main reason for this is that it only happens if I initiate it. He has tried initiating a few times, but invariably only when I'm dog tired or ill - I think he subconsciously must have some block against asking at appropriate times. I find it hard to ask because the answer is almost invariably no. After several rejections, it is hard to summon the courage to face another.

By far the most agonizing problem concerns the deficiencies in the sexual relationship we have. My husband feels no desire for me, and it shows in everything to do with sex. The way he looks at me, his attitudes to my appearance, the way he touches me - everything is affected by it. It also means that if I look at him in a desirous way, it does not register - and if I touch him in a desirous way, it does not arouse him (in fact, he doesn't like it). He never makes those little comments that husbands often make to their wives, implying sexual interest in them. An asexual person might say: "why is this such a big deal?" To me that's like saying: "what's so great about using your eyes to see?"

There is much more, and much of it is very subtle and difficult to explain. What it comes down to, in short, is that I feel the equivalent, in sexual terms, of being unloved. There is no way to describe this feeling, but it's almost as significant as being emotionally unloved.

To me, it feels like a prison. From my marriage (in my 20s) until the death of one of us (because neither of us wants a divorce), I am consigned to life without being the object of sexual desire, and without having an adequate (responsive) outlet for my own feelings of desire. I feel almost as if I were a seeing person required to wear a blindfold for life. It really is almost that significant a thing to give up.

The hardest thing about all of this is simply coping, and coming to terms with it. I know now that my husband will always be what he is - he has been through therapy and we have talked, and this is really him. I do not want to be married to anyone else - for reasons other than sex, I want him. So I am stuck. At first, when I learned about asexuality, I thought infidelity might be an option - but I now understand that asexual people often feel even more strongly about infidelity than do sexual people - and my husband is one of those who could not really cope with infidelity. So I have a choice between my marriage and my sexuality. I have chosen my marriage - but I have not yet come to terms with what I have lost in making that choice.

Part of the struggle is that there is a part of my mind still working on how to be both sexually fulfilled and married to my husband. I realise now that this is utterly fruitless. But it's very hard to let go. It feels like I am trying to cope with a death, and that I haven't been able to let go of the person who has died.

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dragonwitch

Black Hawk

I was in a relationship such as yours...........except that you have

enough heart inside you to try and find a way to communicate

with your wife.

I never knew there was such a thing as being asexual, and my

husband took my "coldness" as rejection. I loved this man with

my entire heart and soul.

I did everything I could to make up for the fact that I had no

sexual feelings but it was never enough. I spent 18 years

"tolerating " his sexual appetite and the relationship finally

"broke" and so did my heart when he left me for a sexually

active younger woman.

You and your wife have the possibility to have a very long

loving life.......how lucky for you both to have found this

community.

Please KNOW that extremely deep, long lasting love is

possible even though the sexual end of things may not be

balanced. I STILL love my ex-husband even 7 years after

the "end".

May you and your wife find your balance.

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dragonwitch

Black Hawk

I was in a relationship such as yours...........except that you have

enough heart inside you to try and find a way to communicate

with your wife.

I never knew there was such a thing as being asexual, and my

husband took my "coldness" as rejection. I loved this man with

my entire heart and soul.

I did everything I could to make up for the fact that I had no

sexual feelings but it was never enough. I spent 18 years

"tolerating " his sexual appetite and the relationship finally

"broke" and so did my heart when he left me for a sexually

active younger woman.

You and your wife have the possibility to have a very long

loving life.......how lucky for you both to have found this

community.

Please KNOW that extremely deep, long lasting love is

possible even though the sexual end of things may not be

balanced. I STILL love my ex-husband even 7 years after

the "end".

May you and your wife find your balance.

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Hippygrrl

Geez!

How can you have sex and BE an asexual? Sex ialways seems to be inthere..., even denying yourself by taking "vows"is considered the paramount sacrifice or proof of fervor in a great many religions.

We as "Asexuals" are defining ourselves by openly stating we're not interested in sex. But I truly believe that wanton sex, meeting someone at a party then "getting it on" for a one night stand, etc. is not only unhealthy ,especially in this day and age of STD's but corossive to the Psyche. People are deep creatures, need acceptance, respect, fulfillment..., sex in & of itself is NOT enough..., its no coincidence either that many people that I've encountered on this website are EXTREMELY intelligent and very articulate about their feelings & passions..., sex is a big thing in life, fer sure, but intense people need intense understanding & love..., "cheap thrills" or animalistic gratifications jus' ain't gonna cut the mustard with most of us!

My story: I've been married twice, have 4 childern & 4 grandchildern..., am very happy and proud to be near them. My romantic life has seldom risen above the passion of a Disney movie; but I don't care,even though I'm alone now. I always wanted a family, its just the sexual end of things created problems for me..., we shouldn't confuse sex with childbearing or love..., in fact, I think being asexual nowadays is the smart thing to do!

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Mith

I'd just like to share my little story with the board.

First off, I consider myself to be asexual even though I'm only 16. It might have something to do with going through puberty, but I thought you were supposed to have increased sexual desire at this point in life but I'm still not attracted to anything sexually, so I doubt it's going to change when puberty is over with me. I feel left out at times though because all of my friends have had sex and I'm still a virgin. It feels like I don't fit in with them because I don't know what they're talking about when they discuss sex. So I want to have sex to fit in but I can't because I really don't want to.

The second half of my story is that I have a boyfriend and I just told him about my "preference." We've been dating for over 9 months-which I hear is a long time in my school, being the average is 2.5 months-and, despite our ages, we love eachother. I actually would like to spend the rest of my time with him because he's really nice and funny and he makes me feel safe. Anyway, I always thought him to have a higher sex drive, but he would never want me to do anything I was uncomfortable (which I'm also hapy for, because I know a few people that kind of "push" people into doing things, when they might not really want to). Just a few days ago though, I looked into asexuality and I found that it really describes how I feel and I decided I should tell him first because next to me, he's probably the one who will be affected the most. And to my surprise he took it pretty well. I almost thought he would break up with me but I knew if he really did love me, he wouldn't and he didn't do it. And then I thought, he might get angry or something or ask me something stupid, but he didn't do that either. I was pretty glad that he didn't take it badly and I think we're off to a good start with understanding. Even though I think he doesn't completely comprehend what it means, I think we can work this out. :lol:

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pablo

It has been a while since I last dropped into this area but knowing that I am feeling that my wife and I are facing another difficult time (my wife is asexual) I felt I needed to check if there was anything on here that could help me make sense of my feelings. Of course there is! even if the conclusion is that trying to deal with conflicting sexual needs is difficult and confusing and frustrating. It seems to me that there are so many dilemmas.

For a start if you love someone you should be faithful (or at least thats the way I was brought up) and I do love my wife very much. However there is this urge which I would describe as being physical which wants to overcome the way I think (I guess if I mentally decided not to drink anything eventually the physical need would take over). My wife is not ignorant of my feelings but has found a happier life with me than with any other man because I have recognised her feelings and so that is the way I would want it to be (even though every so often I wish she would have sex with me).

I have seen what lonely in love and mkt have posted and I believe I feel the same frustrations. However I am conscious of the fact that you do not truely know someone til you live with them and whilst I have considered whether ending the relationship is for the best I am convinced that on every other level other than the sexual one I could not find a better person. If nothing else how long would it take me to find someone you could talk to about these issues.

Anyway we got to the stage of recognising that my needs are just as legitimate as her needs and that meant we decided that I should try a prostitute (or female escort - not cheap and nasty) which my wife helped pick so she knew what I was doing. We decided our faithfulness is based in trust and I was not about to run behind her back.

The prostitute has the advantage of keeping the transaction strictly to sex and my wife knew that I was hardly likely to run off.

The deed was done and sure enough my wife still felt a little insecure and I felt completely weird telling my wife honestly what happened (in answer to her questions which is part of the trust thing). However it did confirm how attached we are to each other and my abstinence and her willingness to allow this is a sign of strength.

Unfortunately sex with a prostitute was just a process and was nowhere near as good as the intimacy my wife and I have enjoyed (whether that be sex or private physical closeness). So another dilemma which arises as a result of the love I feel for my wife - shopping elsewhere might still not be the answer.

For sexual people I think there is a tendency to assume (and forgive my directness on this ) that a good shag (British term not referring to the dance craze!) will sort everything out. Not necessarily...

I do not know where we go next although my wife and I are aware of a single close friend of hers (who she trusts) who is desperate to be close to a man and it may be that we go there but it has so many potential complications that I suspect we might not. The point being that we can even talk about that.

What I wanted to say is that the frustrations of being in a sexual - asexual relationship can lead to thinking sex (any sex!) is the answer and sometimes it isn't. I think we have to look at how much we feel for our partner and really ask whether we believe that as a whole person is there likely to be someone who is better to be with.

I have been very frank in the hope that my thoughts might help even though I know some people reading this might want to pass judgment. That is fine we are working together as a couple to reconcile two opposite urges and this is our way of trying to deal with it. I do not know where we will go next but we will always put trust at the core of all that we do.

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Rosemary

I liked what Pablo said and admire his love for his partner. I had the same situation and got married 3 times and divorced also. had 4 children and had a nice boyfriend but he is the sexual type and I talked to him about my 'fears' and told him that I feel like something inside me is changing and is shifting like Mother Earth. Women and Mother Earth feel the same changes and I know that my path is more for the universal love than only for one person. I know that all this sacred energy I am 'wasting' on sex should be used for healing, loving and taking care for. I think that we should respect others and told my ex boyfriend that I can't be selfish and if he really need sex, I can't hold him forever. He has the right to be happy also. We are now in the time of universal lovoing and will come the day that we can feel a mental spiritual orgasm just by loving with a clear heart and soul.

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Fram

It is deeply moving to hear from sexual people willing to live without sex for the sake of love. I never believed that the relationship sexual people promise to be "more than friendship" is anything but lure. Yet this may be IT.

It may be that (at least some) asexual people live in their hearts and minds and souls to the extent that nothing trickles down to their lust machines any more (except for the normal biology).

It may be that this intense deep unfathomable emanation of their soul is more attractive than anything that flesh may ever promise -- but never does fulfill. It may be that this invisible, inaudible, intactile love offers a security which once one comes near to, will never want to part with, no matter what it takes.

No matter what it takes. It must be very hard to live that way. Doing the impossible : keeping the knot tied on a cord tensed between the extremes. Bearing the unbearable. It may be easier to do even more. There are ways to lift one's consciousness above the sexual centers, into the heart, the mind and the beyond. I know many sexual people who practice yoga in order to achieve the asexual state. They do.

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mkt

Hi from mkt! Interesting to read the last few posts... as an addendum to my situation: I have also discovered that just "sex" is not the answer. I want to be close to the person I love - my partner. I'd rather stay with him w/o sex, than lose him -- BUT I do experience intense physical/sexual/emotional frustration from the lack of sharing sexuality with him --- and the real issue is that he is unwilling to compromise in any way whatsoever - he will not accept an open relationship, or compromise in any way to ease my frustrations. I love him tremendously, but am I the only one who is responsible for making this relationship work? It seems so. I am being as flexible as possible... perhaps he is being as flexible as he knows how, but he seems unwilling to try *anything* to make me more comfortable, or acknowledge my needs.

I've learned... of course sex with an escort or someone else isn't satisfying... I want that connection with the person I love. He can't give it to me... I refuse to think I am a bad person for wanting him to change just a tiny little bit to acknowledge my needs and make our relationship more of what I want. I'm in this relationship too after all! I'd love to be some spiritual embodiment of perfect love - but I'm just human and sometimes the fact that I am doing all the changing and compromising really angers me! Where is his spiritual love for me? Where is his idea of sacrificing for me?

Sorry if all this sounds bitter... I read the posts on this list soemtimes and it seems soem asexual people on this list are an alien species - how can we communicate with each other when asexuals think I can so easily give up sex? It's not just nothing, it's not just a physical act. It's a deep connection I have shared with my partner before and now he refuses... that is not easy to transcend. Unless I reach sainthood of course!

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Orbit

mkt, I feel for you. I think many asexuals have experienced so much alienation for not wanting sex that they are very bitter and demanding of sexuals to understand their needs - but reversely there are many asexuals who simply do not want to acknowledge that sex is a natural need for people who are sexual.

I'm so sorry your relationship isn't working out. You sound like you are doing everything you can and he just isn't meeting you any bit of the way. That is very unfair, but it might be just all he is capable of doing. I would consider suggestiong you both go to a counselor, but I don't think there are many who understand asexuality enough to be fair to your partner - which may be a reason he wouldn't want to go.

Perhaps it's time to separate for awhile? To see how much the two of you need each other and want to work on it. He also needs to know you are serious and suffering so much that you are considering options.

Ultimately, I don't believe you should feel it's all on you to make this work. I am asexual married to a sexual, and we still have issues sorting out when to have sex, but I know it's a need and so I do my best to treat it as such.

good luck... keep us updated.

hawke

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mkt

Thanks hawke... there are asexual individuals on this list who are very kind and sympathetic and understanding. Thank you for the support. I can't help but think sometimes that sexual/asexual relationships seem harder for sexual women trying to make it work with asexual men. I wonder if that is because most women are taught they should change for their partners, and bear a burden of feeling "responsible" for pleasing a partner sexually... and men aren't (generally) brought up that way. Women are brought up to believe men "need sex" and women don't (which I think is totally untrue - I think it's not a gender issue, it's a libido issue). When I read this list, it seems that asexual women so often try hard to compromise to make their partner happy - even to the point of being more willing to try therapy, or an open relationship, which few asexual men seem willing to do. Does this ring true for others? If any asexual men with sexual partners want to comment, I'd like to hear from their perspective...

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Orbit

You may have something there about the role of women and men - I think I've seen it where there are other problems in relationships as well; such as addictions, abuse, helping around the house - it's usually the women trying to change to please the man and the men have a harder time believing they should change JUST to please the woman. They'll do it if they have something to gain in it though - which is probably why I suggested you separate for a time.

A good friend of mine is having to move cross country away from her husband because his disappearing for days on end and ignoring her and the kids and addictive behaviors just wouldn't stop. As soon as she packed up and he realized she was serious he started changing... but it was too late.

Another good friend of mine tried counseling for years and years and did everything she could think of to get her husband to realize the way he treated her was unacceptable (again ignoring her for days on end), and she ended up having to divorce.

I know it's not that women have no fault, but I think your theory on what society teaches women about trying to please and not teaching men that same thing is very possible.

Thankfully my husband does very well when it comes to wanting to please me and change where he needs too....

hawke

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Fram

mkt, this is complicated...

asexuals think I can so easily give up sex? It's not just nothing, it's not just a physical act. It's a deep connection I have shared with my partner before and now he refuses...

If you started out as a sexual couple and were committed as such, then one of you changing all of a sudden to totally asexual without consideration of the other does not seem right. If your significant other found out that he was asexual, it would seem reasonable to talk it over with you so you reach a consensus about the gentle and gradual ebbing of your sex life, while at the same time improving your deep levels of communication and your life together on planes other than sex. For you this privation of sex seems to have left a serious void. This void needs to be filled. Not necessarily with sex; more by working together at finding that higher love and cultivating it, while gradually weaning yourselves from sex. Love is not privation. It is its opposite. Fulfillment. Which quite frankly, sex isn't. You said it yourself:

I have also discovered that just "sex" is not the answer. I want to be close to the person I love - my partner.

It is quite possible that your partner does not feel deprived at all, because he feels your love, same as before, and does not miss sex. He may not have replaced sexual tenderness with anything perceptible to you. Your privation, from that "loss", he is not aware of, because he cannot perceive it as a loss. To him it may be a relief :shock: How can he comprehend that to you it is loss? Not difficult to imagine a man having no idea about subtleties like this. Yes, in most cases it is the woman of the couple who is the main channel of love, while man is that of reason. The only way this discrepancy between you two can be resolved is through deeper communication. An exchange deeper and more committed than sex.

It seems you have that determination

I'd rather stay with him w/o sex, than lose him

A few lucid questions though:

is he really worth it?

could it be a physical condition that makes him avoid sex?

does he love you nearly as much as you love him?

and

WHAT ELSE IS THERE IN THE WAY OF YOUR INTIMACY OTHER THAN LACK OF SEX??

because, as DJ here put it: "It turns out that when everything else works, sex just isn't as important."

your concern that

sex? ... that is not easy to transcend. Unless I reach sainthood of course!

:lol: :lol: thanks, mkt :lol: :lol: does anyone on this site :roll: like a saint to you?? :lol: :lol:

Asexuality is not really that hard--if everything else works.

But you may not want to listen to anything I say, because I am only a sexless hedonist. Pleasure without pain is my motto.

Sainthood, on the other hand, (in my humble opinion) is the ultimate hedonism. Absolute bliss with no memory of pain. That is impossible to attain. Yet people have.

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mkt

thanks for the comments, questions. The only other important part - besides sex - that is missing is my partner's lack of flexibility. He refuses to change at all - and he refuses to see his attitude about sex as *our* problem, as a relationship issue. He realizes it is unfair to me, but refuses therapy, or to see a doctor, or to allow an open relationship.... or well, anything. No matter how much I love him, I don't know if I can accept this refusal work out what I see as a relationship glitch. He admits it is unfair to me, but says he'd be uncomfortable with any alternative I propose.

I wish I could work it out - but I can't do it alone - and he refuses to help. .... doesn't this seem suspicious somehow? I mean, he used to be interested in sex, and he changed over the space of a few months. He claims he loves me, he claims there is nothing wrong between us... but the more I read this list, he doesn't seem to fit asexual as I see it here. There have been times in his life he's been very sexual - our first year together. Maybe I have to consider that he is (unconsciously?) trying toend our relationship and doesn't know how else to do it... or that he has a deep psychological problem, or soem physical problem he won't face. <sigh> this is too painful for me to deal with right now... I don't think I'll ever understand him and I just have to let go. Clearly he has different ideas of how people work on relationships than I do... if I say no sex is a problem for me and if he refuses to work that out (somehow!), then I feel I am doing all the work/compromise, and it's not fair to me. too painful right now... too damn painful... I need to go forget about this for awhile...

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apparentlyblue

This is going to sound *so* naive, but I didn't realise how big a deal sex is to sexuals until reading this thread. I think because some of us are just pretty indifferent to it we don't really see how difficult it can be to try and ignore.

Communication really is vital because each just can't see things through the other's eyes - we just don't know what it's like to live with that hunger, and you can't imagine what it's like to just not have that instinct.

Before finding AVEN, I didn't even realise that I wasn't that normal, I didn't realise how important sex is to most other people, so I just thought my boyfriends were being insensitive assholes.

This thread has opened my eyes more to the need for compromise, and has enabled me to see how much of a struggle it can be for sexuals. I think some asexuals can be a little guilty of seeing it as 'We're the ones being made uncomfortable by sex, so why would you want to put us through that?'.

I don't know what sexual frustration feels like, but in comparing it to a hunger, I can understand the discomfort that exists on both sides, and the need for a compromise to at least be attempted.

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mkt

Apparentlyblue, thank you SO MUCH for posting that last post. One of the reasons I stay on this list is to try to understand my (possibly asexual) partner, but another is to share my thoughts and reactions with people who have a hard time understanding a sexual perspective exactly because sexual/asexual are so different. If we can understand each other a little more, the world will be a better place :) . There should be room for all people in the world regardless of asex/sex, orientation etc. and asex/sex relationships shouldn't be hopelessly doomed. I think more compassion for other perspectives is always a good thing, so your post made me very very happy!

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apparentlyblue

*beams*

We can all learn a lot from each other. I'm just kinda getting into a relationship at the moment. My first honest-about-my-asexuality relationship. And we're very much finding our feet and working out how this is going to work.

Reading through this thread and particularly your posts, mkt, I can see that there is more to this situation than my own discomfort. I think sex can be viewed as a hobby that other people like to indulge in, and therefore don't really see that it is a powerful drive in sexuals, an instinct which can't be ignored easily; seen like more of a choice, rather than something that is a big part of who the person is.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I know I'm pretty guilty of this. But I see more clearly now that she's being an absolute goddess about it, willing to try her best to sacrifice her own needs [which are much realer than I realise] for me to be comfortable with her.

But the lines between sensual and sexual, and the lengths to which we can both be stretched are something we both have to learn, if we are going to make this work.

It is a hard thing, understanding a point of view completely foreign to everything that you have always lived with. You can only learn from each other, asking questions to really get to grips with how the other person is experiencing the situation. I know she doesn't really understand my asexuality, but I think you've helped me a little way towards understanding her own sexuality.

Thank you.

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mkt

Reading the last post is my best moment yet on this site! I know open, honest communication between two people in a relationship is extremely important - when combined with a desire to compromise and work together, almost anything is possible (I think!) - asex/sex relationships can work, because sex is not the most important part - finding the connections that make the love between you and your partner grow is most important. For many (not all apparently) sexual people, that connection has to include some kind of sexuality - and I wish everyone would stay open minded about that. It doesn't have to be intercourse or "typical" sex - it can be whatever two people can compromise about and both feel okay with.

It's funny (okay, not so funny really) I often think about this issue in terms of age these days --- in my 20s there is no way I could have done w/o sex - it was such a strong physical drive (and part of my identity) for me that I was truly out of my head (unable to concentrate, angry, tense) if I was sexually frustrated for weeks on end. Now, as I approach 40, I can tune down that frustration and focus more on companionship, conversation, doing things together with my partner. Age has definitely taken the edge off my need for sex and allowed me to value other aspects of relationships more.

Anyway... I think this site had definitely provided a bridge for understanding... and provided some hope too. :D

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Ereinion

Hello,

It's great to read all your stories in this subject. My boyfriend and I talk a lot about this subject but it is very nice to hear more stories of people who are in the same situation.

I agree with Apparentlyblue, I never knew that a sexdrive could be so strong. I always thought that it would be a little bit stronger then how I feel about sex. Ofcourse this was before I discovered that I was asexual. Talking to my partner I now know that it is completly different; what it means to him and what it means to me. I'm glad we talk about it so we can get to understand eachother.

Everybody, thank you for your stories and good luck to everybody! I hope everything works out, what way you go.

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the other one

It's great coming back to this after a long absence. I had become pretty depressed by some of the posts from asexuals - so I add my thanks to apparentlyblue. I find it hard to read the opinions of people who don't appear to have any desire to understand how I feel about sex (female sexual, married to asexual). The criticisms suggesting we sexuals overrate sex and underrate other aspects of relationships are just hurtful.

Anyway, it's also been good to read the posts from pablo, mkt and hawke - good to find others - at last! - in a similar position to myself.

I've been married over a decade, and intend to stay that way. It has certainly not been easy. We went to Relate (relationship counselling) early on, and this got us past a period when we simply couldn't have sex at all. However, I can't say things really improved for about a decade. My husband finally went for counselling. Not knowing about asexuality, I had hoped this would "cure" him - it did not, but it helped him become a great deal more comfortable about having sex. Essentially, it helped him accept himself better, so he could relax. Sex is still a rare event for us, but I can at least say that things have improved. I'm now mainly trying to come to accept the way things are - they are not really "acceptable", but I think I can live with it anyway. It's worth it.

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Barcode

Wow. The content of this thread has been eye-opening for me. My first love and I ended our relationship when we could not agree on sex. She was adamant for a daily event and I leaned more towards once a year (I did not know about asexuality back then). We eventually settled for once a week but we were never truly happy about the brokered "deal" either. We fought all the way then we broke up. At the end of the 4 years she accused me of not being in love with her from the very start. But I was in love. Yet her accusation stood: If I could not stand to fuck her how could I love her?

For awhile after, I hated myself intensely. She was my first love, I was quite depressed. But I realize now that it was a lack of communication that ruined it. We should have discussed sexuality and asexuality (we never did that) and reached a common understanding. We should have stepped into one another's shoes instead of getting mad. I am starting to think fair. Thank you.

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JustEdwin

Hello everyone!

Well this will be my first post here. :)

Hm perhaps I should introduce myself first... But, then I could just do that right here.

I'm 29 year old Sexual guy, and two months ago I met an asexual girl. Up until I had met her, I didn't really know much about Asexuality. Until she told me about this site and I read some things about it.

From the moment I met her... I knew she was someone special to me... and in the time that followed, that feeling stayed, and grew. She means the world to me. At first however, she did not mention that she was asexual... actually she didn't know that she was asexual... But it soon became clear to me at least that she wasn't comfortable about sex. I have never been someone who pushes and I have always tried to be very careful and patient with her. I am always like that with people I get involved with. But when I first started noticing that she didn't feel comfortable about this... I felt horribly rejected. I felt ugly, I felt as if I had failed.

Luckily, and to my suprise... we both were able to talk about all of this... And of course there were a lot of very tensed moments... but I feel that by talking we grew closer together and helped me to understand her so much better. But it wasn't until she and I discussed her being asexual that I started feeling a lot more comfortable. And that I started realising that it wasn't me. She really liked me! Maybe it's stupid that it didn't really dawn to me before... Up until that time... I just felt that somewhere she was doubting me, and that I was repulsive or something like that.

I consider myself lucky with the few nice people I have had in my life so far... And I have always considered sex to be one of the most beautiful things you can share with your SO.

But now I have met her, and she is asexual... And I have never met someone asexual before... so there was no real way for me to look at it in a different way than what I just said. But what I realised quickly enough is that I care for her so much... and that after really 'talking' to my own heart, I saw, and felt that I was really fine with her not wanting to have sex. All of the things that we are able to share are enough for me!

Of course I am a sexual person. And I do enjoy sex. And I know I have told her that sometimes in my heart I wish we could have that. I don't think there's anything wrong with saying that. But that doesn't mean I have to have that. And it doesn't mean I expect her to change. If it never happens, I am very fine with that.

One thing that frustrates me a lot sometimes is the fact that I can see, and hear that she is troubled by this so much... but I can't seem to do much to help her. I want to help her! I love her so much, and it pains me to see she's struggling so much.

And when she is so very troubled... she can be 'far away' to me, emotionally, and that sometimes makes it hard... Because I keep wondering what goes on inside of her... I want to help her, reach out... I want her to be happy... I want her to smile. I want her to enjoy all that she can enjoy.

And most importantly... :) I want our relationship to work out. She means the world to me.

I have no clue if I wrote all that I wanted to ... I tend to get a bit chaotic... :) but... I hope it helps, and maybe some of you would like to respond to my post. I'd appreciate that very much!

and sorry for the load of text :P

-Edwin

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