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Binding: safety vs sleep/sanity?


Lirpaderp

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I wore my binder for 19 hours today and I can't get myself to take it off. The past few nights I've been unable to sleep because I go to hug my bear and my boobs get in the way and make me feel like shit. I want to bind safely, but finals week just ended and I'm desperately in need of sleep. In 2 days I have to go from a place where my friends call me he/man to a place where everybody calls me she/woman and I'm scared. Boobs are making everything worse. Along with the fear of telling my family. Which I can't postpone because my friend at college is also friends with my siblings and called me he in front of them and I'll have to explain myself.

 

I haven't slept in my binder yet, but I have been wearing it 12-20 hours every day for the past 3 weeks (I got it 3 weeks ago). Any advice? I'm exhausted and would love to sleep with this on but my body is tired of wearing it. But I don't know if I'll be able to sleep with boobs tonight. But I also need to wear it tomorrow during the day. Sleep vs binding safety? Please help. Mentally I need to keep it on. Physically I should take it off. 

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SamwiseLovesLife

Sorry you're feeling this way lovlie but PLEASE DO NOT sleep with a binder. If you ever intend to have top surgery you could ruin your results or even chances if you bind too much

Also wearing one too much can inhibit your breathing and cause lung/rib damage

I often hug something while sleeping semi on my back/side so they're not in the way and also so my arm can lay below my chest and it feels like I'm flat

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I don't use one of these, but my partner does.

 

Trust me, there's good reason that they tell you not to keep it on all the time.

 

It's not going to be the end of the world.  It might be if you fuck up your body, though.  You only get one.

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Please don’t bind for as long as you are. If you mess up the breast tissue too much it can screw with your chances for top surgery.

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If you would like a compromise, maybe consider switching between the binder and milder forms of compression combined with looser-fitting clothes. Sometimes, stuff like compression sports bras (I used to call them "sportswear" for my own comfort) can be a good alternative when you're in your own home, as there's still some compression, but not so much that you risk stuff like cracked ribs from extended wear. Maybe even consider lighter compression like gynecomastia shirts if you want to avoid anything that could be labeled as bras. I'm definitely more on the side of sleeping with zero compression if you can help it, but otherwise, I'd say to go for the most mild forms of compression you can tolerate. 

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My suggestion would be to sleep in a sports bra. It doesn’t flatten like a binder does, but it can provide a bit of compression so you don’t feel them moving around so much. That’s what I did pre-op. Binders can be dangerous to sleep in due to how they restrict your breathing. I’ve read a few stories of people who stopped breathing in their sleep and then woke up and had to cut of their binder, so a sports bra is certainly much safer because it wont stop you from breathing.

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6 hours ago, Irelandaz said:

My suggestion would be to sleep in a sports bra. It doesn’t flatten like a binder does, but it can provide a bit of compression so you don’t feel them moving around so much. That’s what I did pre-op. Binders can be dangerous to sleep in due to how they restrict your breathing. I’ve read a few stories of people who stopped breathing in their sleep and then woke up and had to cut of their binder, so a sports bra is certainly much safer because it wont stop you from breathing.

A lot of my sports bras are tighter around my ribs than my binder. I was stupid when I thought it would feel better a size lower (Don't worry, my binder is the correct size). I tried sleeping in them and it didn't help.

 

14 hours ago, Mezzo Forte said:

If you would like a compromise, maybe consider switching between the binder and milder forms of compression combined with looser-fitting clothes. Sometimes, stuff like compression sports bras (I used to call them "sportswear" for my own comfort) can be a good alternative when you're in your own home, as there's still some compression, but not so much that you risk stuff like cracked ribs from extended wear. Maybe even consider lighter compression like gynecomastia shirts if you want to avoid anything that could be labeled as bras. I'm definitely more on the side of sleeping with zero compression if you can help it, but otherwise, I'd say to go for the most mild forms of compression you can tolerate. 

I don't own anything like it. I probably should. All my clothes are loose fitting. I started going a day with a sports bra but I couldn't take it and had to put the binder back on. I dread taking it off even when I've been home alone all day.

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8 hours ago, Lirpaderp said:

A lot of my sports bras are tighter around my ribs than my binder.

Hey I know cuz I wear sports bras that are lower sizes too. Try stretching/ sewing them to fit better and if they get to be too loose you can double up.- YouTube probably has a vido on that.

 

possible sleep with a pillow in between you and your bear? 

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I know it sucks but you really, really don't need to wear your binder for more than 8-12 hours a day (it kind of varies for different people's bodies).  Definitely a bad idea to sleep in it though.  Yeah sports bras hurt my ribs much more than my binder does.  I'm just counting the days until I can have top surgery.  I hope things work out for you.  Best of luck.  :) 

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On December 17, 2017 at 12:46 AM, Lirpaderp said:

I don't own anything like it. I probably should. All my clothes are loose fitting. I started going a day with a sports bra but I couldn't take it and had to put the binder back on. I dread taking it off even when I've been home alone all day.

I'm mostly suggesting looser compression for times when you're not out and about, like when you're in for the day and not interacting with other people or even right before you go to bed. I personally found ways to disassociate with my chest when I was alone and didn't have to feel self-conscious around people, and I often used the sensation of not being bound up as a taste of what being post top surgery would feel like. The dysphoria was still there, but tolerable enough to sleep through.

 

Easier said than done for all of this, but you sound like you're in serious need for top surgery, and I'm going to strongly suggest setting money aside and doing some research into surgeons, because getting surgery is a long process, and the sooner you get everything set up, the sooner you can move forward. That said, for your short term situations, you'll definitely need to find ways to tolerate being out of your binder, and you sound like you need to work on mental coping mechanisms for this dysphoria in order for even the compromise options to work out. Have you considered talking to a therapist or counselor? Going to one for coping mechanisms can also net you the therapist letter you need for top surgery anyways. My heart breaks for you, and I understand just how painful dysphoria can be, but I really hope you find a way to preserve your physical self as well.

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10 hours ago, Mezzo Forte said:

I'm mostly suggesting looser compression for times when you're not out and about, like when you're in for the day and not interacting with other people or even right before you go to bed. I personally found ways to disassociate with my chest when I was alone and didn't have to feel self-conscious around people, and I often used the sensation of not being bound up as a taste of what being post top surgery would feel like. The dysphoria was still there, but tolerable enough to sleep through.

 

Easier said than done for all of this, but you sound like you're in serious need for top surgery, and I'm going to strongly suggest setting money aside and doing some research into surgeons, because getting surgery is a long process, and the sooner you get everything set up, the sooner you can move forward. That said, for your short term situations, you'll definitely need to find ways to tolerate being out of your binder, and you sound like you need to work on mental coping mechanisms for this dysphoria in order for even the compromise options to work out. Have you considered talking to a therapist or counselor? Going to one for coping mechanisms can also net you the therapist letter you need for top surgery anyways. My heart breaks for you, and I understand just how painful dysphoria can be, but I really hope you find a way to preserve your physical self as well.

Top surgery can never happen. I can't even get up the guts to tell my siblings or mom. I'm too scared to tell my roommates too. I don't want to tell them until I'm sure. I asked a small group of friends at school to call me he/him and it feels amazing. But I want to be sure of myself before I tell anyone else. I can't start thinking about top surgery. I know I wouldn't regret it, but it can't happen until I can say I'm not a girl without feeling shame. Plus extended family can never know, so I'd need to keep it a secret from them and that would be impossible. There's no way it will ever happen.

 

My coping mechanism has been to shut down. I don't control that. Last time it happened I didn't feel anything for a week. Before that I was emotionless for years. Sometimes I can tell when I start to shut down and prevent it. It hasn't happened since my friends started calling me he. The binder really helps. I'm at home and my mom calls me girlie and a girl on a daily basis. Wearing it keeps me sane. Right now my binder is my coping mechanism.

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1 hour ago, Lirpaderp said:

Top surgery can never happen. I can't even get up the guts to tell my siblings or mom. I'm too scared to tell my roommates too. I don't want to tell them until I'm sure. I asked a small group of friends at school to call me he/him and it feels amazing. But I want to be sure of myself before I tell anyone else. I can't start thinking about top surgery. I know I wouldn't regret it, but it can't happen until I can say I'm not a girl without feeling shame. Plus extended family can never know, so I'd need to keep it a secret from them and that would be impossible. There's no way it will ever happen.

 

My coping mechanism has been to shut down. I don't control that. Last time it happened I didn't feel anything for a week. Before that I was emotionless for years. Sometimes I can tell when I start to shut down and prevent it. It hasn't happened since my friends started calling me he. The binder really helps. I'm at home and my mom calls me girlie and a girl on a daily basis. Wearing it keeps me sane. Right now my binder is my coping mechanism.

That fear will pass. Trust me, it will pass. I once felt that way myself, so scared of what others will think, so overwhelmed by the thought of having to reveal the skeletons in my closet. Your mind will adjust, and you'll start to feel more comfortable in sharing your identity with others. Those fears will pass.

 

Maybe I'm weird, but I brought up top surgery with family before I knew I was trans. I did mention that I was still questioning my gender, but I knew beyond a shadow of a doubt that top surgery was absolutely necessary for my mental health.

 

Also, unless you start walking around shirtless, people really don't notice top surgery. I didn't tell my extended family except for my grandparents (they're both medical professionals,) and nobody has noticed. In fact, nobody has ever commented that my top surgery was noticeable or caught on that I even had surgery unless I said something. Heck, I even had one person assume that I already had top surgery when I was still pre-op. It's an amazing procedure, but that surgery is more for treating physical dysphoria than helping with social dysphoria or even passing. (I can also say that I've met women who told me that they had double mastectomies, and I genuinely didn't notice that they were flat. Most people just don't give the chest that much attention.) You would have to go out of your way to have others learn of your surgery. 

 

The binder can play a pivotal role in coping, but it's not a sustainable solution in the long term. You can do real damage to your lung capacity in addition to the strength of your ribcage if you wear it consistently/long enough. The way to make that solution last longer in a safe way is to limit the use to when you need it most. There's ways to develop new coping mechanisms, and a therapist –especially one versed in both gender issues and cognitive behavioral therapy– can help you with that. Honestly, I didn't expect to have access to testosterone as quickly as I did; rather, I originally went to therapy expecting CBT/healthier coping mechanisms. 

 

I know that it's easy to shoot down every potential solution, but please consider looking for additional ways to cope. Even if just temporarily, find a middle ground between preserving your psychological health and your physical health. Also really consider your long term solutions. I'm going to be honest, it sounds like top surgery is a medical necessity for you, and there aren't a lot of alternatives that can so thoroughly eradicate chest dysphoria without health consequences. Please sort through your feelings about why top surgery doesn't seem like an option for you, and figure out why you see binding 24/7 as the only potential solution. Perhaps sorting through those feelings will help you find alternative coping mechanisms that could help you treat dysphoria in a way that's less taxing on the body.

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@Mezzo Forte

I'm most afraid I'd regret it. Right now all I really want is for people to call me he/him, for my chest to disappear, and for people to stop calling me a girl. (Less hips, nothing that comes from periods, less disassociation from parts down there, ability to pee standing, and to find a name not associated with being a girl would be great too.) Does all that make me a boy? What if it changes? How possible is it for me to ignore everything and pretend to accept my body? I'm debating between possible regret later and happiness now. Telling my family would get rid of so much discomfort but what if I'm not ready? Will I ever be ready?

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12 minutes ago, Lirpaderp said:

@Mezzo Forte

I'm most afraid I'd regret it. Right now all I really want is for people to call me he/him, for my chest to disappear, and for people to stop calling me a girl. (Less hips, nothing that comes from periods, less disassociation from parts down there, ability to pee standing, and to find a name not associated with being a girl would be great too.) Does all that make me a boy? What if it changes? How possible is it for me to ignore everything and pretend to accept my body? I'm debating between possible regret later and happiness now. Telling my family would get rid of so much discomfort but what if I'm not ready? Will I ever be ready?

Fear of regret is such a common experience among trans people, it's almost painful. It's a serious concern to address, but there's a point where it kind of becomes dead weight. Let me ask: if you had to choose now to commit to never pursuing transition, would you regret that decision? If transition would make you feel happy now, why do you feel like it wouldn't make your future self happy?

 

I've been in this same boat before with the same fears, and I completely understand the hesitation to share this information with anyone. Honestly, my mom only knew of my questioning because I needed her help to make my top surgery possible, that the sooner I gave her time to process that, the sooner I could actually move toward surgery. I didn't come out to my dad as trans until 10 days before my first testosterone shot. Coming out is scary, and I know that I never wanted to say anything until I was completely certain. That's why I spent four years actively questioning my gender before I came to terms with myself.

 

If there is something that might help give you some perspective, try keeping a log of sorts. Rate your dysphoria or indicate if you're experiencing dysphoria every day. Maybe put contrasting ratings of comfort presenting as female or male, or something to that effect. Something like this will basically become empirical evidence to help you with the questioning process. 

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41 minutes ago, Mezzo Forte said:

Fear of regret is such a common experience among trans people, it's almost painful. It's a serious concern to address, but there's a point where it kind of becomes dead weight. Let me ask: if you had to choose now to commit to never pursuing transition, would you regret that decision? If transition would make you feel happy now, why do you feel like it wouldn't make your future self happy?

 

I've been in this same boat before with the same fears, and I completely understand the hesitation to share this information with anyone. Honestly, my mom only knew of my questioning because I needed her help to make my top surgery possible, that the sooner I gave her time to process that, the sooner I could actually move toward surgery. I didn't come out to my dad as trans until 10 days before my first testosterone shot. Coming out is scary, and I know that I never wanted to say anything until I was completely certain. That's why I spent four years actively questioning my gender before I came to terms with myself.

 

If there is something that might help give you some perspective, try keeping a log of sorts. Rate your dysphoria or indicate if you're experiencing dysphoria every day. Maybe put contrasting ratings of comfort presenting as female or male, or something to that effect. Something like this will basically become empirical evidence to help you with the questioning process. 

If I had to choose now to commit to never pursuing transition, I'd regret it. I would feel hopeless. I already do now knowing it can't happen, but there's a tiny piece of me that says it might be possible. 

 

I try to avoid situations that make me uncomfortable. I've been wearing boys clothes for years now. My hair is really short, and I love my suit. I felt terrible when I was on a sports team with only girls, and awful in two different 'all girls' singing groups. When I joined a sport that had boys and girls practice together I did fine. I was uncomfortable at the meets when we were separated. One day we did stairs and no girls showed up. It was just me and the other guys and I felt in place. On the robotics team in a mostly male setting I felt completely comfortable too.

 

I don't present as female anymore (except traits I can't control). And I wouldn't think to go back. I still have some girly shirts but I only wear them when I've been unable to do laundry or when around extended family. Last time I wore a girly shirt that was tighter around the chest I was upset all day and didn't know why. By the end of the day I had some real scary thoughts and also wanted to cut my chest off.

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All the little Lights

About the regretting thing: You only know how you feel now, and how you think you are going to feel. You don't know how you will be feeling in a few years. So the only thing you can act upon are the feelings you have now. In a few years, you will either say "oh, I still like that decision I made" or "well, it doesn't fit anymore, but I did what was right then and felt good then". Also, what's the point in suffering now just because it might change later? Also, for me I feel it probably won't change.

And things like your clothes,name, pronouns etc. can be changed back.

 

What I also wanted to say (it's in your first post I think) is that you don't need to explain yourself. Even if some people call you by a different pronoun, you can refuse to tell them why (if noone makes a fuss about it, they might even think it was a mistake). There might be other solutions like only telling your siblings and making them keep it a secret, or making your friend use the wrong words for you around your family.

 

For me, it really helped to talk about top surgery with a professional. They didn't ask " are you sure?". Instead, they told me how I could get comfortable with having surgery and how I will certainly feel better afterwards. For me, having doubts about that all the time, even though I also have disphoria all the time, that was such a good thing to hear.

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Like others said before me: Don't use a binder longer then then the reccomended 8 hours. If you do it for longer you can cause serious damage to your breast tissue wich will make top surgery impossible. I don't wear bra's or whatsoever when i sleep as i don't find it neccessary to hurt myself when i'm supposed to use my time to recover. Maybe you could wear a top or something? It's just a few things that popped in my head. Sports bra's are a great idea to consider next to binders. I currently have one tanktop binder and a good amount of frogshaped sports bra's. I personally prefer sportsbra's over binders though but each to their own.

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Maybe you could try to reduce dysphoria in other ways?  Wearing a binder for too long can be really dangerous and make it harder to get top surgery later on.

 

I don't know if this would help or not, but to reduce dysphoria from periods and stuff without HRT, I'm on continuous birth control.  I just skip the placebo pills every month for about three or four months, and then I take them and have a normal period.  This helps me a lot and I only have about 4 periods a year.  Also reduces crazy hormonal changes and PMS.  Talk to your OB/GYN though cause I'm def not a doctor.  They also have different birth controls that are made to be taken for a few months continuously.

 

To help with chest dysphoria, I've started really working out and trying to get fit since muscles usually come across as more masculine, plus reducing chest size. 

 

(Also I made a thread a while ago about looking less feminine without top surgery or HRT that might help.  I'll try to link it if I can figure out how.) LINK <---

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21 hours ago, Lirpaderp said:

@Mezzo Forte

I'm most afraid I'd regret it. Right now all I really want is for people to call me he/him, for my chest to disappear, and for people to stop calling me a girl. (Less hips, nothing that comes from periods, less disassociation from parts down there, ability to pee standing, and to find a name not associated with being a girl would be great too.) Does all that make me a boy? What if it changes? How possible is it for me to ignore everything and pretend to accept my body? I'm debating between possible regret later and happiness now. Telling my family would get rid of so much discomfort but what if I'm not ready? Will I ever be ready?

I'm just wondering since top surgery might not be possible would you consider say breast reduction?  it would not eliminate your breasts but it could reduce them to a much smaller size and thus maybe more manageable for you? just a thought

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1 hour ago, Albine said:

I'm just wondering since top surgery might not be possible would you consider say breast reduction?  it would not eliminate your breasts but it could reduce them to a much smaller size and thus maybe more manageable for you? just a thought

If I did anything, I'd want to get rid of them. Going through all the trouble to reduce them when I don't want them at all wouldn't be worth it. I want them gone. But I need to make sure I know what I truly want before I take any action. I just need to bring it up to my mom. Maybe she can talk some sense into me, or affirm that I need them gone. Either way I need to tell her. I'm not looking forward to it. Maybe I don't have to say anything....

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