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Trump is amazing!


ConorOberst

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I liked Trump before it was cool.

8)

 

But seriously, I've been supporting him since before he was elected. You won't find sympathies here with these people @ConorOberst

 

Trump's presence in the universe feels like destiny to me, because he keeps doing the impossible. It seriously feels like we fell into an alternate timeline.

 

Can't wait for those 800 sealed inditements to go out.

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Trump may have said he wanted to be ”pro-worker” or whatever, but in practice he's been absolutely toothless in doing anything about it. He backpedaled extremely hard on Nafta and started kissing China's ass.

 

In reality, he's pushing the same toxic, destructive neoliberal agenda as always.

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11 minutes ago, Still said:

Trump may have said he wanted to be ”pro-worker” or whatever, but in practice he's been absolutely toothless in doing anything about it. He backpedaled extremely hard on Nafta and started kissing China's ass.

 

In reality, he's pushing the same toxic, destructive neoliberal agenda as always.

He's reduced unemployment claims so much, it hasn't been this low since 1973. He has done everything about it. 

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9 minutes ago, Yato said:

He's reduced unemployment claims so much, it hasn't been this low since 1973. He has done everything about it. 

He's also giving tax cuts to the corporations, thus implicitly rewarding them for their greedy anti-labor practices. That's Neoliberalism! *laugh track*

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Just now, Still said:

He's also giving tax cuts to the corporations, thus implicitly rewarding them for their greedy anti-labor practices. That's Neoliberalism! *laugh track*

He gave tax cuts to everyone. 

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4 minutes ago, Yato said:

He gave tax cuts to everyone. 

He should've excluded corporations, for obvious reasons.

 

Honestly, people talk about opening eyes: yes, they do. They need to open their eyes and realize that neoliberalism is the real enemy.

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Mostly Peaceful Ryan
2 minutes ago, Still said:

He should've excluded corporations, for obvious reasons.

America has some of the highest corporate taxes in the world. If they lower it, corporations can have more income to hire more people and grow the company in the future. It's a matter of staying competitive with other countries.

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7 hours ago, ♣Ryan♣ said:

America has some of the highest corporate taxes in the world. If they lower it, corporations can have more income to hire more people and grow the company in the future. It's a matter of staying competitive with other countries.

In this day and age I'm doubtful it'll work like that. More than likely, they'll turn to automation or find some other method to keep as much of the money inside the corporation.

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On 14.11.2017 at 10:28 PM, Homer said:

@ConorOberst

 

I'm sure you can back those claims up :)

Still giphy.gif'ing

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Mostly Peaceful Ryan
2 hours ago, Feys&Florets said:

In this day and age I'm doubtful it'll work like that. More than likely, they'll turn to automation or find some other method to keep as much of the money inside the corporation.

Depends on what type of company we are talking about, however even automation is giving someone a job whether it be engineers or mechanics to keep up the equipment as well as any other company making the machine. It still will boost the economy and should have an effect on unemployment rates. Money tends not to just stays in a rich persons pocket, most people with money invest to get more money. 

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The Terrible Travis
12 hours ago, Yato said:

I liked Trump before it was cool.

8)

It's still not cool.

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3 hours ago, Homer said:

Still giphy.gif'ing

He made a post in another thread awhile back that he was going to be leaving the forum permanently, but he'd leave an email contact if people wanted to keep up a debate.

 

So, I'm pretty sure he's not going to be replying anytime soon.

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43 minutes ago, ♣Ryan♣ said:

Depends on what type of company we are talking about, however even automation is giving someone a job whether it be engineers or mechanics to keep up the equipment as well as any other company making the machine. It still will boost the economy and should have an effect on unemployment rates. Money tends not to just stays in a rich persons pocket, most people with money invest to get more money. 

 

That might work for now, but the current system of economics is changing toward a fully automated system. 'Giving jobs to engineers or mechanics' isn't what the blue-collar workers voted on him for. They wanted a steady secure job for themselves. But in reality, no one wants to pay the expensive labor cost for them. It's not a long-term investment, only a quick fix that'll last...oh, maybe four years. Then it's the next president's problem.

 

I'm genuinely upset Trump rolled back regulations and opened up coal mining. It's filthy, it's polluting, it's dangerous, it's non-progressive, and in the end, any so-called economic benefits for miners will be tossed out and just be replaced by cheap automation that never get sick or form unions. 

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The West needs to start preparing for a ”post-work” society sooner rather than later. The reason for this won't be automation, though: it'll be neoliberalism making it impossible to earn a living wage.

 

Can't wait for the time ten years from now when we're stuck in the nightmare realm between neoliberal ”the unemployed and poor are lazy” rhetoric and all of the few jobs available either paying pennies as an ”independent contractor” with zero rights or being unpaid ”internships”.

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23 hours ago, Still said:

Trump may have said he wanted to be ”pro-worker” or whatever, but in practice he's been absolutely toothless in doing anything about it. He backpedaled extremely hard on Nafta and started kissing China's ass.

 

In reality, he's pushing the same toxic, destructive neoliberal agenda as always.

You keep saying neoliberal to everything you don't like. It's doubtful you know what it mean, remind me of far right people who call everything socialist.

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7 minutes ago, ThaHoward said:

You keep saying neoliberal to everything you don't like. It's doubtful you know what it mean, remind me of far right people who call everything socialist.

I do know, although I am admittedly guilty of using it as a blanket term for policies that benefit corporations/rich people and screw over everyone else (and it's not like term is necessarily that well defined these days). Having said that, you can't deny that obsessive deregulation has done a hell of a lot of damage in the last 30+ years.

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Mostly Peaceful Ryan
18 minutes ago, Still said:

I do know, although I am admittedly guilty of using it as a blanket term for policies that benefit corporations/rich people and screw over everyone else (and it's not like term is necessarily that well defined these days). Having said that, you can't deny that obsessive deregulation has done a hell of a lot of damage in the last 30+ years

There are some negatives and people who abuse the system, but it isn't like that is every case. The move towards capitalism globally has lowered the extreme global poverty rate by 50% in the last 30 years. 

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30 minutes ago, ♣Ryan♣ said:

There are some negatives and people who abuse the system, but it isn't like that is every case. The move towards capitalism globally has lowered the extreme global poverty rate by 50% in the last 30 years. 

Not to speak of the massive increase before that too. Yes capitalist nations such as Germany have unemployment, but they get support. Now the economy of East-Germany there was a lack of paper. The economy was so poor that the state couldn't even afford to produce propaganda - which was one of the mainthings they did. So yeah, capitalism is better and its proven when you look at history. That do not mean it's perfect nor that we can fix current issues, but it is superior to anything else (basically feudalism and actual socialism). There can't be a coincidence that all nations who tried full blown socialism ended up with mass starvation, deaths, stagnation and inflation. Look to USSR before the NEP and then after it, Vietnam after the war, Mao's great leap etc. Great tragedies. Yet all other nations didn't fall to the same extreme mismanagment.

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5 hours ago, ThaHoward said:

Yes capitalist nations such as Germany have unemployment, but they get support. Now the economy of East-Germany there was a lack of paper. 

The USSR had 100% employment, though :P And support for the unemployed is exactly what neoliberals are against: evil public funding.

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40 minutes ago, Still said:

The USSR had 100% employment, though :P And support for the unemployed is exactly what neoliberals are against: evil public funding.

No one should have to support people they don't want to. Because everyone knows someone who won't work, or are lazy and would just collect hand outs. 

 

So what happens when people refuse to work?

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4 minutes ago, Yato said:

No one should have to support people they don't want to. Because everyone knows someone who won't work, or are lazy and would just collect hand outs. 

 

So what happens when people refuse to work?

Make unemployment payments less than what you can make by working. Of course, since neoliberalism seeks to destroy workers' rights, the problem is that companies soon will only employ temporary workers/”independent contractors”/unpaid ”interns”, making work unprofitable.

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Mostly Peaceful Ryan
2 hours ago, Still said:

The USSR had 100% employment, though :P And support for the unemployed is exactly what neoliberals are against: evil public funding.

That's because they shipped people to Siberia and forced them to work until they died from freezing if they refused to work. Jeeze dude you are demonizing the system responsible for lowering extreme poverty rate by 50% in 30 years, while supporting a system that has literally killed over a hundred million people and that isn't counting the people starving to death under its rule. 

 

1 hour ago, Still said:

Make unemployment payments less than what you can make by working. Of course, since neoliberalism seeks to destroy workers' rights, the problem is that companies soon will only employ temporary workers/”independent contractors”/unpaid ”interns”, making work unprofitable.

I'd rather be an independent contractor, then a person living in the USSR during its height or any other socialist country.

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6 minutes ago, ♣Ryan♣ said:

That's because they shipped people to Siberia and forced them to work until they died from freezing if they refused to work. Jeeze dude you are demonizing the system responsible for lowering extreme poverty rate by 50% in 30 years, while supporting a system that has literally killed over a hundred million people and that isn't counting the people starving to death under its rule. 

I thought the smiley would've been enough to show my statement was dripping in irony... I'm not a communist, and being against neoliberalism is not the same thing as being against capitalism as a whole.

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Mostly Peaceful Ryan
Just now, Still said:

I thought the smiley would've been enough to show my statement was dripping in irony... I'm not a communist, and being against neoliberalism is not the same thing as being against capitalism as a whole.

Oh thank god, I was losing hope in humanity for a second there, my mistake.

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4 hours ago, Still said:

The USSR had 100% employment, though :P And support for the unemployed is exactly what neoliberals are against: evil public funding.

And until the 1970's the farmers of USSR wasn't allowed to leave their farms, have passports etc. And if they didn't deliver the needed quota, sorry comrade. A miner had to work for 16-18 hours a day - truly a worker's paradise. And the economy was in a constant depression when looking at numbers and even during the coldwar they dependant on the bad neo-liberal nations to help them out with grain not to starve. And of course the unemployed in the neo-liberal nations had it quite well compared to most people in the workers's paradises.

 

Just a random assortment of stuffs. 

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10 hours ago, ThaHoward said:

And until the 1970's the farmers of USSR wasn't allowed to leave their farms, have passports etc. And if they didn't deliver the needed quota, sorry comrade. A miner had to work for 16-18 hours a day - truly a worker's paradise. And the economy was in a constant depression when looking at numbers and even during the coldwar they dependant on the bad neo-liberal nations to help them out with grain not to starve. And of course the unemployed in the neo-liberal nations had it quite well compared to most people in the workers's paradises.

 

Just a random assortment of stuffs. 

If you hadn't noticed, I already said the USSR remark was a joke. Besides, the current full blown neoliberalism didn't really start until the Thatcher/Reagan era.

 

Neoliberals wish they could introduce 16-18 hour workdays in the West, but unfortunately for them workers still have some rights (for now).

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29 minutes ago, Still said:

If you hadn't noticed, I already said the USSR remark was a joke. Besides, the current full blown neoliberalism didn't really start until the Thatcher/Reagan era.

 

Neoliberals wish they could introduce 16-18 hour workdays in the West, but unfortunately for them workers still have some rights (for now).

Said neo-liberals who gave corn and grain so USSR wouldn't starve?

 

And whoever these neo-liberals are there are no parties, unions, employer organizations etc that want to establish a 16 hour workday. So again I doubt that you really know what you mean by neoliberal as there is no one who really have that as a goal. It's on the line with Obama wanting to have planned economics.

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39 minutes ago, Yato said:

Are Neo-liberals the new fascists? :huh:

That's the Trumpists! ;)

 

Joking of course.

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