Is it possible for an asexual to be a rapist?

[Rynn]

3 hours ago, Star Bit said:

That would still be desiring sex for emotional pleasure and thus not Asexual.

So you would also say that it's impossible for straight men to rape other men? Do I need to bring up prison rape?

You know rape can be committed by inserting objects, rather than one's own genitals, right? 

It can be done with the intent of hurting or humiliating the victim/survivor, in order to 'put them in their place'.

It's usually not about pleasure at all. It's about power.

[Tja]

4 hours ago, Star Bit said:

 

That would still be desiring sex for emotional pleasure and thus not Asexual.

YES!

[Tja]

37 minutes ago, Laurann said:

So you would also say that it's impossible for straight men to rape other men? Do I need to bring up prison rape?

You know rape can be committed by inserting objects, rather than one's own genitals, right? 

It can be done with the intent of hurting or humiliating the victim/survivor, in order to 'put them in their place'.

It's usually not about pleasure at all. It's about power.

Can you give evidence to show the percentage of object rape versus penile rape?

[Rynn]

13 minutes ago, Tja said:

Can you give evidence to show the percentage of object rape versus penile rape?

I don't see why it would be relevant which type of rape occurs more often, but here's a study that does that:

Spoiler

Characteristics of sexual assaults in which adult victims report penetration by a foreign object

https://doi.org/10.1016/j.jflm.2009.11.001

Abstract

This retrospective clinical audit reviews cases of adult sexual assault where the victim alleges that they were penetrated with a foreign object. These assaults were more likely to have positive genital and non-genital findings recorded by the clinician compared to assaults where no object was used. There is a suggestion that these assaults may be more violent with multiple assailants more common and an association with more use of threats and weapons. It is important to ask about the penetrative use of foreign objects in a sexual assault history and for clinicians to be aware of the greater possibility of injury in these cases.

 

I don't want to infringe on copyrights, so I'll send you the full study that I accessed through my university in a private message.

[Tja]

5 minutes ago, Laurann said:

I don't see why it would be relevant which type of rape occurs more often, but here's a study that does that:

  Reveal hidden contents

Characteristics of sexual assaults in which adult victims report penetration by a foreign object

https://doi.org/10.1016/j.jflm.2009.11.001

Abstract

This retrospective clinical audit reviews cases of adult sexual assault where the victim alleges that they were penetrated with a foreign object. These assaults were more likely to have positive genital and non-genital findings recorded by the clinician compared to assaults where no object was used. There is a suggestion that these assaults may be more violent with multiple assailants more common and an association with more use of threats and weapons. It is important to ask about the penetrative use of foreign objects in a sexual assault history and for clinicians to be aware of the greater possibility of injury in these cases.

 

I don't want to infringe on copyrights, so I'll send you the full study that I accessed through my university in a private message.

*Thank you for pm'ing me.*

 

I was just curious about that info.

This thread is about Asexual rapists. An Asexual would be more likely (IMO) to use an object, rather than their genitals.

People making statements about using objects does not prove an Asexual is capable of being a rapist.

 

I still find it hard to accept that an Asexual would resort to a sexual means of control.

I am not disputing that rape is about power. *No offense, but, constantly going off-topic to re-state this is unnecessary*

I am disputing that an Asexual would use a sexual act to dominate another person. *The actual topic of this thread*

[Rynn]

26 minutes ago, Tja said:

I am not disputing that rape is about power. *No offense, but, constantly going off-topic to re-state this is unnecessary*

I don't think that's off-topic at all. If the definition of asexuality is 'a lack of sexual attraction/desire' and I can demonstrate that rape is not about attraction/desire, then I have proven that asexuality and rape are not inherently incompatible. Asexuals are not excluded from being potential rapists by definition, so it's not impossible that an asexual could be a rapist. That is the literal topic of this thread. I think this line of reasoning is very direct and streamlined, actually.

26 minutes ago, Tja said:

I am disputing that an Asexual would use a sexual act to dominate another person. *The actual topic of this thread*

Well I don't think it's likely that that would happen, and I certainly wouldn't understand what in earth would possess an asexual to do such a thing, but it's not impossible. *The actual topic of this thread.*

[njosnavelin]

Quantum mechanics  says by putting my hand on the wall and pushing my hand it will push through the wall -- eventually.

 

The possibility of my hand pushing through the wall is there! If you are looking for a, "is it possible answer" than it is yes. There will always be the possibility. 

 

The likelihood is much much smaller. It is stated there are 1% of the population is asexual. We are discussing over really really really small numbers in terms of the possibility. 

[Tja]

2 minutes ago, Laurann said:

I don't think that's off-topic at all. If the definition of asexuality is 'a lack of sexual attraction/desire' and I can demonstrate that rape is not about attraction/desire, then I have proven that asexuality and rape are not inherently incompatible. Asexuals are not excluded from being potential rapists by definition, so it's not impossible that an asexual could be a rapist. That is the literal topic of this thread. I think this line of reasoning is very direct and streamlined, actually.

Well I don't think it's likely that that would happen, and I certainly wouldn't understand what in earth would possess an asexual to do such a thing, but it's not impossible. *The actual topic of this thread.*

Touche!

I agree with most of what you're saying.

However, (IMO) being Asexual is incompatible with rape.

 

[Tja]

Just wanted to say: I've never discussed this, in such depth.

While a sad topic, it's a necessary one, and I appreciate all the insights everyone has contributed.

[Rynn]

1 minute ago, Tja said:

Touche!

I agree with most of what you're saying.

However, (IMO) being Asexual is incompatible with rape.

Okay, well, the burden of proof is on you then. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Good luck proving that, I'm listening. 

Careful though, because proving a negative (that something never happens/ that something doesn't exist) is widely regarded as impossible.

[Tja]

2 minutes ago, Laurann said:

Okay, well, the burden of proof is on you then. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Good luck proving that, I'm listening. 

Careful though, because proving a negative (that something never happens/ that something doesn't exist) is widely regarded as impossible.

Perhaps I should change that to "inconceivable"

[njosnavelin]

Until a study comes out with asexuals are not power type personalities we will not know scientifically.

 

I am going to on a limb any say the study being cited is not taking into consideration asexual instead a broader spectrum of people to prove rape is about power play rather than sexual orientation.  I might suggest their sampling for the study is inconclusive to the topic at hand.

 

I will never discount the possibility of rape regardless of gender or sexual orientation or a power play. Rape is terrible in every situation.

[Lia]

7 hours ago, Star Bit said:

 

That would still be desiring sex for emotional pleasure and thus not Asexual.

No, that's desiring to have absolute, ultimate power over someone in a way that they fear most. It's not desiring the act of sex at all. It's desiring the act of gaining power.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Tja said:

 

I still find it hard to accept that an Asexual would resort to a sexual means of control.

Why? Asexuals are not children who cannot understand the impact such a means of control would have on someone. If they wanted to do that sort of damage and nothing else would be quite the same, why would they not go for what hurts the most? 

 

Also, another reason for rape in some cases, is trying to live up to a stereotypical male roles. Asexual sometimes feel they fall short of these roles, so that profile of a rapist would fit an asexual very well. "I must do this, to prove I'm a man" (Lisak 2002, among other studies, go into hypermasculinity as a cause for rape). As well as peer pressure to have sex with a girl that is far too drunk can happen, especially on college campuses. Which, once a person is beyond a certain alcohol threshold, it counts as rape in many places.

And just a disclaimer: I'm not saying all rapists are male, I am aware females can do it as well. However, traditional gender roles for males tend to be more sexual than for females.

 

Another motive from rapists I could see an asexual sharing, would be an extreme anti-sexual attitude. Wanting to punish someone for their sexual behavior, by turning it into an extreme negative for them. 

 

Now, are many asexuals likely to be rapists? No. But, then, not many sexuals are, either, in the grand scheme of things. Most people in general are not rapists. Given we have a low % of the population, the amount of asexual rapists will probably be so low it's almost non-existent. But, it's still absolutely a possibility. For a variety of reasons. Rape doesn't require sexual desire to do. Now, I'm not one of those people that thinks it never has a sexual component to it. Studies do show power is a huge factor, but a lot of the time reasons also include "she shouldn't have turned me on", etc. So, I'm not saying it's never about sex. Just that it doesn't have to have anything to do with sexual desire. 

[songchick]

A person could be a rapist, who is sexually frustrated in that they can't express themselves or are maybe confused?  Maybe like, trying to "disprove" their asexuality?  Not sure what the motive would be, but it would of course be possible.

[Kai99]

19 hours ago, Tja said:

I agree! My point is: an Asexual shouldn't be aroused to the point of wanting sex. Using sex in their power play shouldn't occur to an Asexual. IMO.

An Asexual shouldn't be thinking of using sex as a weapon...as a rapist does.

 

No offense, but we are talking about the rapist, not the victim

Exactly.

 

It is possible but highly unlikely.

[Star Bit]

11 hours ago, Laurann said:

So you would also say that it's impossible for straight men to rape other men? Do I need to bring up prison rape?

 

It's usually not about pleasure at all. It's about power.

No to both questions. And yes I know rape can involve objects. What's that have to do with the subject at hand though? And yes I know rape can be done for either sexual or emotional pleasure, but again, desiring sex for sexual or emotional pleasure period IS sexual and NOT asexual. If someone only desires to rape others they ARE sexual and not asexual. The only way someone can rape someone else and it not effect their orientation is if it's their only option; like you said jail where they cannot access the gender they actually desire.

 

The only way I can think of an asexual commiting rape is if they were literally forced or coerced by someone else to do it or they find rape erotica arousing so they tried it out themselves. But an asexual cannot innately desire to rape anyone for any reason.

9 hours ago, Laurann said:

If the definition of asexuality is 'a lack of sexual attraction/desire' and I can demonstrate that rape is not about attraction/desire, then I have proven that asexuality and rape are not inherently incompatible.

No, that is still DESIRE. Desiring sex for emotional pleasure (be it for power or anything) IS an Allosexual.

[Pramana]

29 minutes ago, Star Bit said:

No to both questions. And yes I know rape can involve objects. What's that have to do with the subject at hand though? And yes I know rape can be done for either sexual or emotional pleasure, but again, desiring sex for sexual or emotional pleasure period IS sexual and NOT asexual. If someone only desires to rape others they ARE sexual and not asexual. The only way someone can rape someone else and it not effect their orientation is if it's their only option; like you said jail where they cannot access the gender they actually desire.

No, that is still DESIRE. Desiring sex for emotional pleasure (be it for power or anything) IS an Allosexual.

This is patently false. It is contradicted by literally every single published paper on asexuality, as well as human rights laws pertaining to asexuality, and AVEN's own definition and statement in support of that definition. 

Asexuality is a lack of sexual attraction. Sex-favourable asexuals exist. AVEN polls on the matter consistently show that a majority of members support an attraction or attraction plus desire definition.

If you are unwilling to accept what asexuality or the asexual community is, that's fine as your personal choice, but it is in no way a factual claim. Rather, it is a manifestly counterfactual one.

Beyond that, as others here have said, rape is often motivated by a desire to assert power and dominance, and so has less to do with sexual attraction/desire anyway.

[Star Bit]

@Pramana @Saesha And you already know that many long time AVEN members (sexual, Gray, and ace) agree that you spew BS and fail to listen to reason on what real sexuality is!

 

Rape has everything to with desire; it is desiring sex period. Its reason DOES NOT change a thing. A ton of sexual people use sex for the oxytocin bonding pay off. Their reason for desiring sex does NOT make them ace.

[Rhaenys]

Star sweetie, not being able to handle people disagreeing with you doesn't count as "many" longtime aven members (I've been active here 4 years before your start date btw  ).

 If these members are real the ones I can think of who'd say that of me have no importance in my life.

 

I just said that rape can be used as a weapon of war  because there was a study by Carly Brown I forgot the name of the study where they said rape is a war tactic used to destabilise populations and communities. That implies the need for power. I named the DRC because with regards to there even the United United Nations considered rape a weapon and Isis because I've seen news and articles about how survivors consider it a weapon.

 

In reality there is no evidence or study pertaining to asexuality and rape for your claim (Sorry your high school cliqué who do not know my 2010, 2012, 2014 aven usernames are not a credible source or proof for your claims ) nor is there for mine.

The OP asked if it is possible and I answered what I think because of what I read in the past and lack of sexual attraction has the possibility of not determining sexual behavior.

 

Pramana and I are not the only ones saying what you don't want to see here. Funny enough you ignored my post which basically had the same idea yesterday until I changed the colour.   @Star Bit 

 

[Pramana]

8 hours ago, Star Bit said:

@Pramana @Saesha And you already know that many long time AVEN members (sexual, Gray, and ace) agree that you spew BS and fail to listen to reason on what real sexuality is!

 

Rape has everything to with desire; it is desiring sex period. Its reason DOES NOT change a thing. A ton of sexual people use sex for the oxytocin bonding pay off. Their reason for desiring sex does NOT make them ace.

Where are these "many long term AVEN members" of which you speak? By the word "many", it appears you only actually mean a couple of people!

To be blunt, I don't care if a tiny number of people with no relevant education or qualifications disagree with me on these topics. I prefer to get my information from credible published academic sources. On that account, it is pretty well accepted that rape often has more to do with power than it does with sex. Also, if desiring sex makes one sexual, then every asexual who desires sex for instrumental reasons and every asexual who has a libido wouldn't be asexual. Obviously, that is incorrect.

[Star Bit]

12 hours ago, Saesha said:

Star sweetie, not being able to handle people disagreeing with you doesn't count as "many" longtime aven members (I've been active here 4 years before your start date btw  ).

 If these members are real the ones I can think of who'd say that of me have no importance in my life.

 

Pramana and I are not the only ones saying what you don't want to see here. Funny enough you ignored my post which basically had the same idea yesterday until I changed the colour.   @Star Bit 

 

I don't appreciate belittlement or being called a compensative lier. I didn't lie, MANY Aven members are against what Pramana says, not just me. @FictoVore. has had more experience with groups of users displaying this toward them so I'll let her explain if she wishes to reply to this. It's not a question of seeing what I don't want to but straight up lies/misconceptions about what real sexuality is. If anything you seem to be reflecting yourself onto me; you're the one who's being compensative with your belittling wording and lying accusation as YOU see me state things YOU don't wanna see. 

 

[TheAP]

A reminder to be respectful of others' differing opinions.

 

TheAP

Questions about Asexuality co-mod

[Digs_Dead_People]

Yes.  Rape is never truly just about sexual gratification or sexual attraction.  It's about power and intimidation and a tweaked person who's asexual could very well be mentally unwell enough to need to power and intimidate someone, and rape is one way to do that.

[Four Eyed Lemon]

Definitely. Like, I read a lot and I've heard and read that rape is often about power rather than the actual sex act. And sexuality just... doesn't make it impossible to violate someone.

[Philip027]

By some definitions of asexual, yes you could.  In my book though, anyone who ever felt inclined to rape somebody (regardless of the reason) is not someone I would ever call asexual.

 

Quote

And the rapist doesn't want sex. They want to control their victim. 

^{[citation needed]}

 

There sure are a lot of people here that think they can speak for the motives of rapists, presumably (hopefully) without even being rapists themselves.  Sounds remarkably similar to the topics where asexuals try to decide for sexuals what makes them sexual, come to think of it.

[Guest]

On 02/07/2017 at 7:56 AM, Laurann said:

I was under the impression that rape was about the exercise of domination and control over a person, rather than about attraction or desire, so I'd say that's possible.

Apparently most men who rape other men are heterosexual.

http://www.secasa.com.au/pages/myths-about-male-rape/

A feminist came up with that false theory decades ago pretty much to prove that all men are dangerous and shouldn't be trusted because they'll rape you even if they don't want sex with you *sigh*. Yet in most cases, rape is most certainly about a desire for that kind of sex, and the sexual pleasure of the rape itself (it's very different than 'regular' sex due to the lack of consent, the terror etc). Some people actually get turned on by the act of rape itself and can't enjoy 'normal' consensual sex in the same way, if at all. Getting sexual pleasure from the power one experiences when raping someone is definitely an aspect of pleasure for many people, but rape solely for power and dominance itself is a lot less common. I've known many people in the past who have raped and often laughed and joked about it, and have experienced it myself, and my mum works in a prison often amongst rapists and other segregated prisoners. In all those cases (and the ones mum has discussed with prisoners) it was about the sexual and emotional pleasure of the rape itself, the sexual gratification of taking sex from an unwilling person, not solely about 'power'.

 

 

https://www.google.co.nz/amp/s/www.psychologytoday.com/blog/insight-therapy/201602/rape-is-not-only-about-power-it-s-also-about-sex%3Famp

 

That article clears the myth up quite thoroughly.

 

To answer the question posed by the OP (this may be triggering for some so don't read further if this is an uncomfortable topic for you!!)

 

An asexual would actually *only* rape for power as they wouldn't be motivated by a desire for partnered sexual gratification as is the case with the majority of rapes. Though it's a pretty silly idea because there are many other ways to gain power over someone and an asexual would turn to those ways first, not bothering with the sex (well, unless they're truly cruel and believe that rape is the best way to terrorise, degrade, and humiliate someone even though they themselves have 0 interest in the sex as an asexual. That can certainly be the motivation sometimes in some cases for some sexuals, like male prisoners of war being raped by soldiers who have been *ordered* to degrade them sexually or whatever, but in 'regular' cases it's far more often about the pleasure received from the actual act of rape which can't truly be replicated with a prostitute or partner during role play. Some people sadly just need the real thing to get off and do enjoy it.)

 

And yes, many people who rape are often not 'sexually attracted' *to* the people they rape. It's often a crime of opportunity and about the pleasure received from the act itself; what the victim looks like (and sometimes even their age or gender) often isn't as important.

 

That's enough of such a depressing topic for me, I'm off to bake a chocolate cake with pink berry icing, nom!

[Pramana]

21 hours ago, FictoVore. said:

A feminist came up with that false theory decades ago pretty much to prove that all men are dangerous and shouldn't be trusted because they'll rape you even if they don't want sex with you *sigh*.

This seems like a bit of a stretch. The feminist theory may be overstated, but I highly doubt that it is a facetious attempt to paint all men as evil.
 

21 hours ago, FictoVore. said:

An asexual would actually *only* rape for power as they wouldn't be motivated by a desire for partnered sexual gratification as is the case with the majority of rapes.

I agree that asexuals are probably less likely to perpetrate sexual assault, but this also seems like a bit of an overstatement since many asexuals still have a libido/sexual desire.

[LandonH]

It's 100% possible

[Guest And Peggy]

"Rape is about violence, not sexual desire. If someone hits you with a spade, you wouldn't call it gardening."

 

—i forget who said this but it's a rly good quote 

 

So, yes.