Lord Grep

#BottyGate Time to tell this Hilarious story...

22 posts in this topic

#BottyGate

OR

Desperately trying to find something to get offended by.

 

This story starts off not long after I joined this site, and I was more naive about moderators than I am now. PLEASE read to the end the payoff is just Great.

 

Before I start though, I would like to make clear that I don't hold any grudges. I was not well known, and it was a bit odd. 

 

The scary thing for me though is how hard moderators were looking to find some excuse to dish out some discipline. Why? I have no idea.. Yeah I am a little controversial from time to time, but I am hardly a trouble maker...  

 

Before I crack on. I will be posting the declassed stuff and links to it, and I did get told off.. I got a nudge and a 3 day ban from this. Though after I show this and what had happened everyone concerned will hopefully just laugh it off. 

 

OK This involved @fiѕh and myself. We had become friends and we enjoyed just messing about. Now there are a few things to note, and they are relevant. Fish is German, and Gay. I am Bi-ish, and I know 15 words of German, and 10 of those are the numbers one to 10.

 

Early one day, I sent Fish a very silly email. It was just daft, a slightly lewd, but a playfully silly email.

 

We both met in chat, and Fish commented on the email I sent him, and we laughed about it, and we kind of jokingly made it out to be worse than it was. We had some banter, and I asked him to post it in chat for everyone to see... He didn't want to, so I just popped it in Google translate, translated it in to German and posted it, thinking maybe someone might reverse translate, but there really wasn't many active users in at the time.

 

There was some Banter afterwards, and then Tal made a comment, and I was still giggling about it, and I tongue in cheek apologised.. I thought no more of it till I got a "Nudge", and a Ban for 3 days from chat because of the "Lewd and offensive language".

 

I was really shocked at the time.. I could see how what I had written was slightly rude, but it was hardly HARD CORE, or even offensive, and there definitely wasn't  any intent of being in any way disrespectful or bigoted. It was just playfully silly, and I had used deliberately inoffensive words, as that is half the joke....  

 

Any way here is the message I got:

################################################### START ##########################################

Lord Grep:

 

The following comment you made in chat has come to the attention of the AVEN Admod team:

 

  Quote

Spoiler
 
 

11/29/16 06:18 PMLord GrepWenn Sie sich jemals einsam und entscheiden, Sie wollen mit einem alten Fett englisch fuck pot, wer will kein spiteful botty Sex überhaupt .. Sie versenden Ihre jungen perfekt geputzt Arsch hier und ich werde Ihr Leben wirklich miserabel

 

I strongly advise against making comments in a foreign language when a Google translation will yield dubious results, especially such explicit subject matter, which many on AVEN would find offensive.

 

As part of this official action ("nudge") for inappropriate chat behaviour, you will be suspended from chat activity for three days from the sending of this post.

 

On behalf of the AVEN Admod team,

Qutenkuddly,

Chat Administrator

 

################################################ END ############################################

 

Now I was a bit blown away, because it was all just very childish and silly. and when I talked to a mod about it they said that someone had said that I used the word "Botty" and this was a Jamaican slur for a homosexual. This was News to me... There was nothing I could do about it. So that was that. But I was really sore about it.

 

Any way..  the longer time went on, the more intrigued I was, as to what the discussion was like when they decided to discipline me. For some reason had something hilarious in mind. Moderators arguing about translations and nuances of words etc. I thought I was going to get e treat of silliness. 

 

Well I waited and waited, and then The MOST efficient and cheerful person I know on here came to my Aid.. @deltaX You are just one amazing fellow..  I cannot compliment the guy enough... Few people in a paid job get things done with as little fuss, and under their own steam.. Thank you again Delta!

 

So I get the decision declassified. PLEASE READ IT... I felt I should feel offended. I mean everyone (bar one) is trying there best to get offended. That and no context was shown at all... It was made to look like I just said it out of the blue..... But don't panic.. I am not going to get all pissy... 

 

Click HERE No really DO IT, and read the thread that got me the nudge, and the 3 day ban. It's an eye opener...

 

Now ignoring all the nastiness, here is where things get funny. It concerns the word "Botty", And you need to read this carefully... Because they made a very silly mistake..

 

Botty means Bottom.. It is the least offensive word any where for your Arse (see I used a dysphemism there).. If you google it, Even the Urban dictionary they are so fond of to judge offence, says is a childish word for a bottom...

 

Now "Batty" that is with an A not an O, while in english means someone a bit stupid, or manic, In Jamaican  if used in conjunction with "Boy" is a SLANG word for a Homosexual... (No this is not the pay off the pay off is way better). 

 

So all those mods thinking so badly of me because they typed the wrong word in to the Urban dictionary? Is this how it works though??.. Really???.. Are peoples single posts, just taken out of all context put under a microscope to such a large degree because they just feel that something "MUST" be offensive that is why it is in German, when the answer was just that Fish is... Well... German. 

 

The worst of it is that what the hell can we say if Urban dictionary is to be the judge? As anything can be a slur in the Urban dictionary? I mean really it can... 

 

Now I wasn't going to post any of this on AVEN, as it is posted somewhere else... But Fish and I were talking last night, and we found out something that made us both laugh for AGES and we just thought .... "We just HAVE to share this".... 

 

See Fish put something else in to the Urban dictionary, I have no idea what inspired him... But this is what the result was:

4wbEbBV.png

Seems just about anything is offensive in Jamaica. 

 

We both hope you let fish keep his name.... I think he might have offended himself. 

 

Who else is sporting Jamaican slurs in there names???? I tried some out... Now @sea-lemon Things only get in to the dictionary if you are "Hairy"... Do you want to know what a "Hairy Sea Lemon" is??? Well disappointingly its just a term for somebody who fails at life. Had you all going there.

 

On a serious note though..... Do you nice mod types not think the time has come to chill out, give people the benefit of the doubt, and just talk to people reasonably before throwing nudges and bans about? 99% Of the users on here are not trying to be offensive, and good natured fun makes for a happy place... Dishing out punishments all the time must be fun from your chairs.. But none of us is perfect, and the only way to never offend anyone, or never say something in the urban dictionary that *MIGHT* be problematic is to never say anything at all...

 

Just for reference HERE is the google page for BOTTY  

botty
ˈbɒti/
noun
BRITISH
 
  1. a child's word for a person's bottom.
     
     
     
    And this is what Urban Dictionary says:
     
     
    Shortened version of "bottom" referring to the rear end.
    "I hurt my botty - whaaaaaaaaaaaaa :'("

     

     

    I think I need to make a browser add on that underlines problematic words in different dialects. 

     

    I just want to finish by pointing out that English is a massively wide spread language, and no one can be expected to know all the ways any word could be used as offensive slang threw out the world. I still have issue with the Fa* word. Where I live, it is an utterly common place word for a cigarette, and the most offensive gay slur many of you would not think of at all.. (unless you are British), DO you think there might come a time when AVEN mods are encouraging each other to just let things go? nudges, and bans just drive people away even warnings do... 

     

    Any way... I hope that gave everyone a bit of a fun ride.. And remember not to call @fiѕh "Fish" or he will likely report you for calling him a Jamaican slur for homosexual. 

     

    ENJOY!!!!!!

 

 

 

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Uh just so you're aware. "Batty Boy" isn't "slang" in English for gay. It's actually incredibly offensive. 

 

I used to hear that phrase shouted at homosexuals while they were being bullied at school. It was graffitied over their lockers. It was genuinely used to torture them. If an Avenite was called that here, you can guarantee it would bring back bad memories. It was also used against men who were particularly feminine or men generally. 

 

My own personal experience was being held back by somebody while a gang at school attacked my brother with a (mathematic) compass while the crowd chanted 'Batty Boy'. 

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:huh: Well that was a wild ride. I would have appealed it if I was in your position (and knew all of this before hand). Got a nudge because they read a word wrong.

 

Also for Ciri's post above mine that's good to know, live in America and never heard that word 'til now.

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2 minutes ago, Ciri said:
 

Uh just so you're aware. "Batty Boy" isn't "slang" in English for gay. It's actually incredibly offensive. 

 

I used to hear that phrase shouted at homosexuals while they were being bullied at school. It was graffitied over their lockers. It was genuinely used to torture them. If an Avenite was called that here, you can guarantee it would bring back bad memories. It was also used against men who were particularly feminine or men generally. 

 

My own personal experience was being held back by somebody while a gang at school attacked my brother with a (mathematic) compass while the crowd chanted 'Batty Boy'. 

 

Fair play, and noted... Where I came from it was just used as a gentle gibe or joke... Thats the UK for you... Kinda illustrates my point though. The only way anyone can know when not to use a word of phrase is when they are asked to stop by someone. Offence really is in the eye of the beholder...

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And now we've agreed that point I'd be obliged if that term isn't used d

 

There's a couple of tenets of English law which are useful to bear in mind. Firstly, presumption of innocence. Namely the accused enters the hearing innocent unless the evidence determines otherwise. Secondly, ignorance of the law is no defence. Namely it is the responsibility of the accused to be aware of what is permitted and what is not permitted. 

 

If you are unsure of whether a term is permitted, please feel free to contact an admod. Even if we have to take a collective decision, because a term my be offensive in some nations but not others, we would much rather advise beforehand than invoke disciplinary action afterwards 

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You attempted to get fish to post that and fish refused, because they knew they'd get in trouble if they did. So, you did know what you were posting was probably going to get you in trouble. Your own friend warned you. You posted it anyway. 

 

I can understand the nudge, given the rest of the content anyway. Sexual solicitation in the chat room is a fine line between acceptable joke and over the line sexual content. And users should be made aware of that line existing, especially if they're posting an (obviously) google translated line and they might not even know exactly what it translates into from a person who is familiar with the language. And, the wording of the nudge focused more on that than the potential slur.

 

For clarification - a nudge is meant for minor offenses, or when you get near the line, or when the line might be crossed accidentally. A way to let the user know to be more careful in the future. A warning is meant for obvious ToS breaches, serious offenses, or when the user obviously knows the line was crossed. 

 

There was some controversy when "Beam me up botty" was used towards George Takei, so there is precedent for it to be offensive when used towards homosexuals. Even if the more common phrase is the other one. 

 

I think the only thing questionable is the chat ban. But, given the vote was so close, I'd say you'll find many admods would agree it was questionable. 

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<watches point being missed>

<realises that humour is as subjective as offence>

<wonders off whistling> 

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what

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3 hours ago, Lord Grep said:

<watches point being missed>

<realises that humour is as subjective as offence>

<wonders off whistling> 

No, there is no point to this, except you wanted to publicly complain and attempt to garner sympathy. Doubt anyone's gonna feed it to you like you're looking for.

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As far as i'm aware Sea-Lemon is not a Jamaican slur, and hairy or not Sea-Lemon's are not failure's.

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7 minutes ago, OptimisticPessimist said:

As far as i'm aware Sea-Lemon is not a Jamaican slur, and hairy or not Sea-Lemon's are not failure's.

It's not. Some random video game fan tried to make it a thing and it's not even remotely Jamaican.

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Still its pretty far to base it on Jamaican when the person is obviously not speaking in Jamaican English. It make it even weirder when a user was not allowed to be named Shit, as it might be offensive, and openly said they named it to Skit since it liteterally mean shit in other languages. Now someone is getting nudged since it nay nean this in Jamaican - which they didn't even know? Or that Batty usually mean button, but is now automatically seen as offensive? Look line trigger happy work for md, or plainly amateurish.

 

Also the dutch argument was the worst. Something along "I am dutch, and here junge may be a slang for penis". Guess what it mean: young. But I suppose we should trust Dutch slang when translating German, instead of i.e Germans or a German dictionary. So when I see ut that way, the Jamaican BS make sense when compared to the Dutch BS.

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A lot is being made of a simple nudge. Okay, let me clarify a few things. Yes, in Jamaican culture, the word 'batty' is a highly offensive term, but that isn't what the nudge was about (read it again). It was about very lewdly suggesting that you may wish to make someone's life miserable by having (spiteful?) anal sex with them.

 

You made this comment in an asexual chat room, which has a high possibility of having sex adverse/repulsed and other members, who may find such comments unpleasant and disturbing. That's kinda why it's mentioned in the Chatroom Rules, that you click to accept every time you enter, to keep "obscenity and sexually explicit chatting to a minimum". Enough of the staff found your comment to a sufficient violation to warrant a nudge and a chat ban. There really isn't more to it than that.

 

 

 

 

 

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but c'mon, a mod telling him that botty was an offensive word IS hilarious tho :lol: 

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but in the nudge, the admods didn't say that was offensive or even mention that word at all

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The only reason I posted the damn thing here at all was because I thought it was just funny.

 

1: I posted something a bit silly when I was naive and new to how strict AVENs rules were.

2: The thing I posted was a translation of something else that was just silly and childish.

3: It was taken so seriously, by people hunting for offence that other than overall message really wasn't.

4: In all the translation and faff someone mistook "Botty" for something else, and then there was a thing about it being a Jamaican slur.. 

5: Then I got the declassed stuff, and that was funny...

 

You know I still would not have posted the thing here even after that...

 

It was only when @fiѕh found out that the word "Fish" was in its self a Jamaican slur for a homosexual that we both laughed so much, I just thought "I just have to post this".

 

To be honest, I was just expecting people to find the whole thing as silly, and ridicules as I have.  

 

Yeah there is a serious point I wanted to touch on about the interoperation of language, and punitive measures.  But overall... I just wanted to share a funny story.

 

My apologies to all those who have got so ansi.. 

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43 minutes ago, CakeSpadeAce said:

but in the nudge, the admods didn't say that was offensive or even mention that word at all

There was more communication that happened after the initial message, as I sought to clarify what the reasoning was.

 

22 hours ago, OptimisticPessimist said:

As far as i'm aware Sea-Lemon is not a Jamaican slur, and hairy or not Sea-Lemon's are not failure's.

<looks at you suspiciously> Yeeees..... 

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22 hours ago, fiѕh said:

but c'mon, a mod telling him that botty was an offensive word IS hilarious tho :lol: 

That was based on hearsay.

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It always seems your humor culminates in mocking others, Grep, and attempting to make them look ridiculous.

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just a reminder to acknowledge the difference in the way people speak in the UK in comparison to the US. depending on where you're from it's normal to say certain things in a certain way. and slang here is completely different.
the joke in question:

If you are ever lonely and decide you want an old fat English fuck pot, who does not want any spiteful botty sex at all .. Then ship your young perfectly groomed ass here and I will make your life really miserable

is a dumb/silly/funny way of saying:
If you are ever lonely and decide you want an old fat English idiot (fuck pot is nothing to do with sex), who is asexual (said in an exaggerated way for humour) .. Then go to the old Fat English idiot I will make your life really miserable (or as i understood it; being with the Fat English Idiot will reduce the quality of your life because they'd be a terrible partner).

The post mocks the person sending it (Grep) he describes himself as the Fat English idiot. 
 
The whole statement is so hyperbolic and ironic, it's funny. (now when i say Grep, i am not talking about the real grep, i am talking about this character he and fish made up (i think) for the joke)

those reading it are put on a pedestal. "young" and "perfectly groomed" describes the reader.

The tone Grep Spoke in was used to emphasise the "Idiot" part of his self description. (e.g. saying 'fuckpot' instead of idiot, saying 'ship your young perfectly groomed ass here' instead of if the young and perfectly groomed person reading this could please come here) It's cringy and not attractive. but it does fit the old, fat english idiot description.

 

The irony of it is that he understands how unattractive he is (attractiveness doesn’t have to be in the visual sense btw,). The Grep character now reaches a new borderline. and you have to pitty him a bit. 
 

"I will make your life really miserable” like i said initially, I believe it means that Grep will reduce the quality of your life because they'd be a terrible partner.

I can conclude that because Grep just spent the last few sentences praising the reader and belittling himself. 

If he meant "I will make your life really miserable” as in “I will put in the effort to bully you and  make you unhappy” He wouldn’t have praised the reader. 
 

In a sad way he wants some one to be with him but is simultaneously warning them that they won’t and shouldn’t accept the offer.

Even going as far as to translate the post into German using google translate (Grep is an English idiot, it suits) Just so the reader would have to go that extra step further to read this post. 
 

The deal is, it’s supposed to be so absurd, you don’t take it seriously. If you know grep (not the joke character grep, the real grep) He’s a nice guy, not an idiot at all. 

This Joke is extremely well thought out and crafted that i’m pretty impressed. 
 

but of course there’s going to be a few people who don’t know the real Grep and jump to conclusions. Maybe they think he really is an old fat english idiot. But the original place it was posted had 0 context before to explain it further. It would be absurd to think he was being totally serous. especially after it was dismissed as a joke and Tal was apologised to 
 

maybe there was someone in the chat who thought of themselves as an old fat english idiot and felt how the grep character felt. leading to them feeling a bit silly
 

On 3/14/2017 at 2:21 PM, Lord Grep said:

I could see how what I had written was slightly rude, but it was hardly HARD CORE, or even offensive, and there definitely wasn't  any intent of being in any way disrespectful or bigoted. It was just playfully silly, and I had used deliberately inoffensive words, as that is half the joke....  

or maybe the swearing was too much? is swearing not allowed on aven, i wouldn’t think so?

Maybe Aven is just not the place to share silly jokes like that. at the most it's cringy. but that's part of the joke. I personally think a 3 day ban is overdoing it, clearly Grep and fish were just being silly and wanted to share a joke. but if that's what the rules are here, then so be it.
 

 

On 3/14/2017 at 3:04 PM, Ciri said:

"Batty Boy" isn't "slang" in English for gay. It's actually incredibly offensive.

It is here. usually the people who use it are homophobic or just kids messing around with bad words because their parents aren't around

Jamaica as a whole though is highly offensive to anything not Cis and Heterosexual. 

I don't see a reason to single out "batty man/boy" as being "highly offensive to gays" because it literally means gay. and to call someone gay in Jamaica is an insult in itself.

 

are you gay? = are you a batty man? disgusting gay=disgusting batty man  

 

*is Jamaican so would know* 

 

my British sister once said to my Jamaican sister "Being gay isn't bad" she replied "you've been living in the west for too long" there is a different culture there for sure.


 

On 3/14/2017 at 2:21 PM, Lord Grep said:

Now "Batty" that is with an A not an O, while in english means someone a bit stupid, or manic, In Jamaican  if used in conjunction with "Boy" is a SLANG word for a Homosexual... (No this is not the pay off the pay off is way better). 

Grep's totally right about that though, no one says botty in jamaica. it's batty. the comparison was obviously made but someone unfamiliar with Jamaican culture.
 

also, i'm inclined to believe that offensive words about a thing can't exist in a culture where the thing in question is not generally accepted. 

Batty also means butt in jamaica.

 

On 3/14/2017 at 8:39 PM, OptimisticPessimist said:

As far as i'm aware Sea-Lemon is not a Jamaican slur, and hairy or not Sea-Lemon's are not failure's.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=hairy+sea+lemon

Hairy sea lemon i doubt is a jamaican slur, but it does mean failure. and Grep was clearly trying to see if anyone else's name on aven had an offensive meaning, or negative connotations etc. Not calling @sea-lemon hairy or a faliure, of course she's not. More trying to say you can't just find a meaning of a word and assume it's meant in a horrible way. because if that happened @fish wouldn't be allowed to have his name. IF (and only if) sea lemon changed her name to hairy sea lemon, the same would apply to her and many other users on aven
 

 

On 3/14/2017 at 8:20 PM, ChillaKilla said:

except you wanted to publicly complain and attempt to garner sympathy

except there was a point to it. I think sharing reasons why you got penalised for doing something is important. other people can learn from peoples mistakes. and maybe even laugh at them too like i did. 

 

 

On 3/15/2017 at 4:16 AM, Qutenkuddly said:

Yes, in Jamaican culture, the word 'batty' is a highly offensive

No, actually it's not an offensive term. it means butt. "Highly offensive" is just exaggerating.
 

 

On 3/15/2017 at 4:16 AM, Qutenkuddly said:

It was about very lewdly suggesting that you may wish to make someone's life miserable by having (spiteful?) anal sex with them.

I can understand why someone might take that part of the joke and run with it. but..... wait a second. he didn't say that, you've totally jumped the gun and changed the meaning. "who does not want any spiteful botty sex at all" 
anal is a lot more "lewd" than saying "botty sex". The Grep character Doesn't want to have "botty sex" because they are asexual. Grep put "spiteful" there because it's Silly and dumb "
English idiot" was part of the joke.

He doesn't "Want" to make someone's life miserable. he will, and believes it's so inevitable, he's gone and declared it as truth. not by "having anal sex with them" *cringe* but by being himself "and old fat english idiot"

 

 

On 3/16/2017 at 4:25 PM, ChillaKilla said:

It always seems your humor culminates in mocking others, Grep, and attempting to make them look ridiculous.

If you read the beginning of my post where i explain the joke, you'll see the whole thing is mocking himself and making himself look like the idiot. Unless i've made a mistake you'd like to point out?

 

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nothing? anyone? 

giphy.gif

can somebody tell me i'm wrong? or is this just an internet hit and run?


 

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