a gender positive thread

[Mezzo Forte]

3 hours ago, SamwiseLovesLife said:

I'm finally slim enough to take photos where I look masc af Also have really nice mens clothing now so Generally look like a 12yo boy in all photos (I'm pre-T)

It feels amazing <3

I know what it's like looking so young, but the nice thing about T is that even if you end up still looking young, you can at least feel more confident when you correct people about your age. I got mistaken for 11 years old when I bought my car last May (over a year on T), but I had someone else tell me that I looked 18-19 recently, and I had a ticket salesperson assume I was an adult even in the company of my parents, which is usually the context that makes people think I'm half my age.  That said, my mom has a very young face, so I'm better off assuming that I'm going to look young for a long time.

 

The only thing that's kind of annoying about looking young is that it can affect how people respond to you as a professor since I could easily get mistaken for a student the way I look. I'm actually planning on keeping my age a secret when I start teaching in the spring, because I am still rather young by professor standards, and my boss warned me that some students may try to take advantage of your youth. Still, I'm going to make wise-cracks about how I first learned how to swim in the Fountain of Youth and that after a few millennia of looking 10 years old that I wanted to update my look.  

 

I'm hoping that once my facial hair thickens a bit, I'll be able to add a few years to my face.  

[daveb]

I had a young/young-looking professor for a class once. First day of class he came in and sat down among the students as if he was one of us (no one knew what he looked like before that), and talked with some of us. Then when class was supposed to start he got up and said something like, "well, I guess I should get this class started" and proceeded to introduce himself and talk about what we were going to be doing.

[Mezzo Forte]

2 hours ago, daveb said:

I had a young/young-looking professor for a class once. First day of class he came in and sat down among the students as if he was one of us (no one knew what he looked like before that), and talked with some of us. Then when class was supposed to start he got up and said something like, "well, I guess I should get this class started" and proceeded to introduce himself and talk about what we were going to be doing.

My dad had a similar scenario like that happen, and there's always the temptation to do that, especially since I look plenty young enough to pull that off. I think I'll wait until I have a little more experience before trying that move though. Besides, this is my chance to dress up in my nice suits, so I may stand out a bit compared to the casually-dressed students  

[butterflydreams]

Just got "her'd" to death at a drugstore. Feels good. Especially after being so down on myself lately for not passing. I can't imagine the woman was appeasing me in this situation. I guess other people will still continue to see it regardless of whether or not I believe it.

[Siimo van der fietspad]

@Mezzo Forte Just found a Parov Stelar playlist and liking what I'm hearing. Wish my sampling skills were good enough to produce this kind of music. If you like this sort of thing I'd recommend DJ Yoda The 30's Edition.

[Mezzo Forte]

3 hours ago, Siimo said:

@Mezzo Forte Just found a Parov Stelar playlist and liking what I'm hearing. Wish my sampling skills were good enough to produce this kind of music. If you like this sort of thing I'd recommend DJ Yoda The 30's Edition.

You'll have to thank @I Am Mel for that suggestion! Ended up checking out some of Stelar's stuff myself and found myself enjoying it. From a glance, that music definitely appeals to my taste in game soundtracks. I'll check out DJ Yoda's stuff too sometime.  

 

If you want to see a cool electroacoustic piece I played in my undergrad days, check out Unreal Motorway by Attila Szilvási. It's a rad piece that I wish I learned under better circumstances. Probably the only piece I've ever seen use meters like 3/3 or 3/12, but those sections are pretty brief and not as complicated as they would appear.  

 

I somehow managed to learn that piece in 3 week's time, but my percussion professor thought I was going to keel over in the process, especially because that was only one of 10 works in my senior recital. On top of that, I was also playing a duet in a friend's recital that was not in my own and I also won a concerto competition/performed with an orchestra with a piece that wasn't in my recital either, so I had over 2 hours of music immediately available in my hands, not counting all my ensemble work either. All while doing a business master's/finishing my music undergrad. That was around the point in my life where music was the only way I could drown out the dysphoria, so I found myself practicing 5-14 hours a day at that point.  

[Mezzo Forte]

Oh, and I'm officially 18 months/1.5 years on T  

 

My sis did a whole photoshoot for me so I could get some professional shots of me with some of my instruments, and she's even taking the time to photoshop some of them to look even better. We also went out for tea, as is my tradition/running joke for how I celebrate transition milestones  

[butterflydreams]

Very cool, @Mezzo Forte!

 

I had a kind of negative that turned into a positive today. A teacher where I work was talking about me to my boss and was like, "oh yeah, I was just talking to him about that." And I'm thinking, wtf? I got a little miffed, after having just passed yesterday and told my friend about it. I told her how I felt like I looked great when I left the house this morning. She said, "you always look female, even if you don't look amazing." I really need to internalize that message, because I think it's true. I don't know how people could look at me and think, "oh, definitely a 'he'". I just don't know. I have boobs for crying out loud! They're not huge, but they are noticeable.

[F1shCake]

I've got a binder and I look flat in the mirror and can fold my arms properly and it's like a hug that gets rid of the boobage (bit itchy but you can't have everything in life)

[K.I.N.G]

On 27/10/2017 at 1:09 AM, Siimo said:

@Mezzo Forte Just found a Parov Stelar playlist and liking what I'm hearing. Wish my sampling skills were good enough to produce this kind of music. If you like this sort of thing I'd recommend DJ Yoda The 30's Edition.

I'll look into it thanks! - personally my favorite song by Parov Stelar is All Night Long but Let's Roll is probably one of his more "gamier" sounding songs - if you like him you may also like the groups Electric Swing Circus or Caravan Palace.

Just on gender and music anyone else imediatly think trans when they hear the lyrics:

Quote

Well somebody told me you had a boyfriend
Who looked like a girlfriend
That I had in February of last year
It's not confidential,

from the killers song somebody told me?

 

 

[K.I.N.G]

On 27/10/2017 at 9:58 PM, Hadley167 said:

. I don't know how people could look at me and think, "oh, definitely a 'he'"

I know im really taking it out of context as i do not pass in the slightest most unfortunatly but i get this feeling too and just dont see how anyone who knows me can look and just imediatly think im a female :/

[Lonemathsytoothbrushthief]

I love my haircut and stuff, and am layering tops tomorrow to feel really comfy because while it's just one I don't feel like my look screams I-am-queer-af-and-not-a-girl enough, also am considering asking my GP for propranolol, nominally for anxiety but also partly because I'm getting anxious because of dysphoria. I have no idea if that's an okay use of it or not tbh...I don't see anything else helping me get myself together other than T or anything and am not really there yet. At least my department generally uses my correct pronouns and name now, I still have about 2 people left to come out to though.

[Emery.]

20 hours ago, I Am Mel said:

Just on gender and music anyone else imediatly think trans when they hear the lyrics:

I love those lyrics!

 

When I first heard it, I thought that it must be about one of those people whose gender isn't easy or even possible to tell. I was something like 8 years old then. Hm. In my mind back then, it was quite obvious that the line between boys and girls wasn't clear cut. There were people who looked like the other gender or looked like neither, adults didn't seem obvious either from time to time, and there were the people who socialised with the opposite gender or both genders. I considered myself a girl quite simply, back then, and didn't give it much thought until puberty. At puberty I noticed I'm gender-odd. Maybe before puberty I wasn't. Who knows. But I vaguely remember believing that gender was some arbitrary assignment as well. So I don't know. I think that maybe I just didn't know myself. I remember feeling shattered and disgusted with myself that I am a boy. I hated boys  They were evil in my opinion. However, I had to face that reality, because my interests matched those of the boys and I had to stick with them. Another shock came when I realised that I'm seriously not straight. I mean... looking back at my childhood quite honestly, it wasn't impossible to tell. I tended to identify with male characters in stories and to play stereotypically masculine things. Like... playing house bored the hell out of me, just like playing with dolls and making up all sorts of drama, I loved being active and outdoors, and competitive, and adverturous. I liked art and blocks too. But yeah. When it comes to gender stereotypes... yeah. I wanted to become a knight or a warrior when I grow up. Hmmm. I liked girly decor, that was it. I think I didn't change much, just everything has counterparts for grown-ups.

[Starbogen]

Today was my first day back at uni since the hurricane and when the professor adressed me he did so in male terms so yay I still pass.

I didn't really doubt it but sometimes when I haven't gone out for a long time I kinda forget what it feels like to be acknowledged as male by people in real life, since my family sucks for that.

But I do look and sound like a boy, no denying that. Actually not even my transphobic family denies that I pass, even if they refuse to use my name and pronouns.

 

Also, I'm not sure how accurate this is but I googled adam's apples and apparently both sexes have one and the difference is just that in males it grows to a visible size while in females it typically stays too small to be visible..? If that's true, then I guess I do have a small but noticeable adam's apple. 

[ChillaKilla]

@Starbogen It’s funny you mention that- I was thinking about something in regards to Adam’s apples the other day.

Apparently it’s not terribly common for transmasculine people on T to grow one, even if they’ve been taking it for several years, but since I started at the tail end of Puberty No. 1, I actually have a small but noticeable one  you can see it when my head is sideways/profile view, and when I talk

[Starbogen]

@ChillaKilla Nice! And same, dude. I always thought I just had a weird looking throat but this is a cool discovery XD 

[Mezzo Forte]

Another shot day, another Shot Song!

 

EDIT: mobile's being really testy with the formatting, so forgive the weirdness and spoilerception.  Also, I finally finished this 10mL vial. (I think it took 4~5 months to get through.) I had been using single-dose vials for so long, that I forget how long 10mL ones can last!

 

 

 

Updated Shot Song playlist/what are Shot Songs:

 

 I struggled with doing my own testosterone shots for a while, so I learned to use my musician instincts to get myself to do the shots quickly and without hesitation. I choose a song, decide what entrance to use for my shot, and I commit like I'm playing percussion.

 

Playlist so far:

 

7/26

A Moment of Silence - Streetlight Manifesto

 

8/9

Toccata and Divertimento - Ney Rosauro

 

8/23

Receiving End of it All - Streetlight Manifesto

 

9/6

Shepherd of Fire - Avenged Sevenfold

 

9/20

Bebete, Vãobora - Jorge Ben

 

10/4

Resurrected Power (SotC) - Ko Otani

 

10/18

Burn My Dread (P3) - Kawamura Yumi

 

11/1

Motumbá - Timbalada

[miauw]

This may sound weird but today is the first day in years that I forgot to put earrings and didn't even notice until the afternoon. Or, this is the first time I am not bothered by my lack of earrings immediately after leaving the house. I don't even know what the deal is with me and earrings but this feels like letting go of a security blanket.

[Andiamo]

I just saw someone that I didn't come out to use my name and pronouns correctly in an email to my college's theater department. That has never happened before, and it honestly made my day so much better.

[SleepyFox]

I find it really hard to like or trust my body for a variety of reasons (cataplexy being a big one), but I like that my arm muscles are lean but can be strong. I like that fencing and dancing makes me feel graceful, or at least able to keep my balance. I like my shoulders and my eye colour, and the fact that one pupil is slightly bigger than the other. It reminds me of David Bowie.

[butterflydreams]

I got called “gentlemen” today when grouped in with a coworker. Ugh. Took a picture of myself later, I’m just not seeing it. Even I’m not seeing it. My friend told me I was really pretty. 

 

Then I went out to eat tonight by myself. Got a basket of chicken wings, because I was hungry. Briefly thought that would be not super ladylike, but I am what I am. How stupid is it that we think someone is less lady or man like for stupid things like that?

 

I give myself a lot of crap, and am super hard on myself, but I really do so much. Eating out alone is scary! But I did it.

[Mezzo Forte]

 

@butterflydreams, you know how many women I've seen enjoy chicken wings? Nothing weird about enjoying messy foods.  I don't understand your coworkers. Are they trying to be antagonistic, or are they just that daft? Either way, I don't see it either. At this point, I feel like a simple "you know that I'm a woman, right?" might steer them in the right direction. Even if you didn't react right away, it's perfectly normal for anyone to get annoyed about being called something they're not enough times.

[butterflydreams]

10 minutes ago, Mezzo Forte said:

Are they trying to be antagonistic, or are they just that daft?

Not antagonistic. If it’s particularly blatant, they usually even correct themselves afterwards. It’s just stressful because I thought I’d be at this new place, with no old baggage holding me down. It’s not even worth sharing the picture of me that I thought was pretty. You all know what I look like, and you know I don’t look like a guy.

 

12 minutes ago, Mezzo Forte said:

I feel like a simple "you know that I'm a woman, right?" might steer them in the right direction.

I don’t feel like I’m brave enough to say something like this. Plus, it’s only going to make the other person feel bad, and I don’t want that. Even if maybe they should feel bad. I genuinely like the people who are doing this. I just don’t know why they’re doing it. And I find it really hard not to blame myself for not passing well enough. I’m sure it’s my voice. Sure of it. I can’t do the voice you hear in videos all the time, so mostly it’s a matter of upping it a little bit, but really sticking the inflections and mannerisms. I still think it should be plenty passable. And in the summative game, when everything adds up, I must be female...but I guess I’m not.

[Starbogen]

1 hour ago, butterflydreams said:

I don’t feel like I’m brave enough to say something like this. Plus, it’s only going to make the other person feel bad, and I don’t want that. Even if maybe they should feel bad. I genuinely like the people who are doing this. I just don’t know why they’re doing it. And I find it really hard not to blame myself for not passing well enough. I’m sure it’s my voice. Sure of it. I can’t do the voice you hear in videos all the time, so mostly it’s a matter of upping it a little bit, but really sticking the inflections and mannerisms. I still think it should be plenty passable. And in the summative game, when everything adds up, I must be female...but I guess I’m not.

I hate having to correct people too, especially because nine times out of ten it'd be because they know my legal name... It's awkward as hell, but if you don't correct people then they might get the very ignorant and incorrect idea that you're okay with being called what they're calling you. If you never correct them they might think it's because you don't mind it, you know?

[Calligraphette_Coe]

1 hour ago, butterflydreams said:

Not antagonistic. If it’s particularly blatant, they usually even correct themselves afterwards. It’s just stressful because I thought I’d be at this new place, with no old baggage holding me down. It’s not even worth sharing the picture of me that I thought was pretty. You all know what I look like, and you know I don’t look like a guy.

Are the folks doing this all guys, all women, or both?

 

See, iIf it were me and I'd finally had enough of it, I'd start psy ops on them. Doing things like using the pronoun 'she' in hypotheitcal conversations such as "Only your doctor can help you make that decision, and she might need more information to come a conclusion with which both she and you can feel comfortable ."

 

Or, "In that app, it seems to me the programmer went with a more heuristic approach because she felt it needed a bit of AI."

 

That whenever you're talking theoretical or hypothetical, make the default collective gender pronouns feminine. It's a way to plant memes that don't get nuked right off the bat, changing attitudes by constant and consistent conditioning.

 

And there are other sneaky things you can do. Those, I will leave as an exercise for the student.  I do this all the time to some of the bigots at work-- that and planting sticky memes. But that's just me. YMMV.

[daveb]

I guess it goes back to being in a male-dominated sector/field/department. I think it's perfectly fine and something any woman might do to correct them and say something like @Mezzo Forte suggested. I like @Calligraphette_Coe's suggestions, too.

[Guest]

7 hours ago, Mezzo Forte said:

 

@butterflydreams, you know how many women I've seen enjoy chicken wings? Nothing weird about enjoying messy foods.  I don't understand your coworkers. Are they trying to be antagonistic, or are they just that daft? Either way, I don't see it either. At this point, I feel like a simple "you know that I'm a woman, right?" might steer them in the right direction. Even if you didn't react right away, it's perfectly normal for anyone to get annoyed about being called something they're not enough times.

It’s all about the chickenwings in the end  

 I enjoy messy food too! I recently went to KFC for a delicious 1person hotwings bucket, the only comments i got was that the bus smelled so nice  and they were getting hungry  

 

@butterflydreams  Like Mezzo said i’d go into the “It’s a girl thing you know!”  direction and i’m pretty sure they’ll drop it right after if you continue enjoying your meal!

[Mezzo Forte]

13 hours ago, butterflydreams said:

Not antagonistic. If it’s particularly blatant, they usually even correct themselves afterwards. It’s just stressful because I thought I’d be at this new place, with no old baggage holding me down. It’s not even worth sharing the picture of me that I thought was pretty. You all know what I look like, and you know I don’t look like a guy.

 

I don’t feel like I’m brave enough to say something like this. Plus, it’s only going to make the other person feel bad, and I don’t want that. Even if maybe they should feel bad. I genuinely like the people who are doing this. I just don’t know why they’re doing it. And I find it really hard not to blame myself for not passing well enough. I’m sure it’s my voice. Sure of it. I can’t do the voice you hear in videos all the time, so mostly it’s a matter of upping it a little bit, but really sticking the inflections and mannerisms. I still think it should be plenty passable. And in the summative game, when everything adds up, I must be female...but I guess I’m not.

I'm sorry that this BS is happening.  Even if the voice were the issue, you've definitely proven that training continues to help it improve. Perhaps you'll gain more endurance with the higher end of your range with frequent enough usage. 

 

Honestly, it's still so hard to picture people misgendering you that it's boggling my mind. Perhaps the testosterone has me acting more reckless, or perhaps I'm at the point of taking passing for granted, but I'm quick to correct people now on the rare occasions that I do get misgendered. Most my documents list me as male. My name is almost exclusively male. I live 100% as male in my social and professional lives. Even if I corrected someone and they started antagonizing me, I have more than enough ways to assert that I'm male to feel confident. Even then, the most I've ever had to do is say that I'm male and people are instantly apologetic. Heck, a confused glance is usually enough to get an apology.  I'd probably have trouble holding my tongue if someone misgendered you in front of me. 

 

You are female. There's no doubts about that. The only way I can see people misgender you is if they are simply pegging you for a transwoman rather than a ciswomen and getting confused trying to juggle pronouns. (Honestly, that's happened to me with people who know that I'm trans.) At the end of the day though, you're still a woman, and even if they misgender you, they're likely still seeing you as a form of woman anyways.

[butterflydreams]

12 hours ago, Starbogen said:

I hate having to correct people too, especially because nine times out of ten it'd be because they know my legal name... It's awkward as hell, but if you don't correct people then they might get the very ignorant and incorrect idea that you're okay with being called what they're calling you. If you never correct them they might think it's because you don't mind it, you know?

Honestly, I think the involuntary wincing on my face, or just the ignoring them because I genuinely don’t know who they’re talking about will eventually be enough. It’s just weird though, because when I try to imagine how I’d react in the same situation, if I were them, it’s different.

 

Like, when I’m introduced to someone, I just go with how they’re presented to me. Hell, one of these women (and @Calligraphette_Coe, it is all women doing this) entered me into the system we use and selected the “female” box for gender. I wouldn’t get introduced to someone one day and then change their gender later. That’s the really weird part. That, I think we can all agree, is harder to do. Meeting someone as Briana, who then becomes Bill. That’s harder to do, no doubt about it. So why are people switching on me?

 

And I still think this is all a gender positive moment, because unlike previously, I’m not freaking out about this. Sure I’m stressed by it and frustrated, but I’m keeping my cool. @Mezzo Forte, I do think these people are just daft. There’s no rhyme or reason why some people get it right and others don’t. The people who do get it right span all ages. Two of the older women there are just so sweet to me. Never missed a “she”.

 

1 minute ago, Mezzo Forte said:

I'm sorry that this BS is happening.  Even if the voice were the issue, you've definitely proven that training continues to help it improve. Perhaps you'll gain more endurance with the higher end of your range with frequent enough usage. 

People who know me don’t know this, but I haven’t spoken in my natural register since college. It’s not the lack of endurance, sometimes it’s just that I’m tired and my voice isn’t loose yet. Like first thing in the morning. I don’t talk a lot during the day.

 

3 minutes ago, Mezzo Forte said:

Honestly, it's still so hard to picture people misgendering you that it's boggling my mind. Perhaps the testosterone has me acting more reckless, or perhaps I'm at the point of taking passing for granted, but I'm quick to correct people now on the rare occasions that I do get misgendered. Most my documents list me as male. My name is almost exclusively male. I live 100% as male in my social and professional lives. Even if I corrected someone and they started antagonizing me, I have more than enough ways to assert that I'm male to feel confident. Even then, the most I've ever had to do is say that I'm male and people are instantly apologetic. Heck, a confused glance is usually enough to get an apology.  I'd probably have trouble holding my tongue if someone misgendered you in front of me. 

Honestly, same. All my documents say I’m female. Doctor says I’m female too. I guess I thought I could be stealth, but I’m just not there yet. I’m still kind of a baby. Not even two years full time. But still, it’s not like people look at me and have to think, “well, I guess female, but I really have to push my brain to think that.” No, even I can’t see male anymore. My face is just so different. I used to look just like my brother. Now I look like my mom. Speaking of which, if you want a chance to not hold your tongue, come to my thanksgiving in a few weeks. You can watch my mom deadname the shit out of me.

 

8 minutes ago, Mezzo Forte said:

You are female. There's no doubts about that. The only way I can see people misgender you is if they are simply pegging you for a transwoman rather than a ciswomen and getting confused trying to juggle pronouns. (Honestly, that's happened to me with people who know that I'm trans.) At the end of the day though, you're still a woman, and even if they misgender you, they're likely still seeing you as a form of woman anyways.

Thanks <3 I think that’s probably part of it. That they are pegging me as trans and I’m probably the first trans person they’ve known. I can respect that. I do know that I pass though. I might not want to believe it, but I do. Dozens of right swipes on dating apps from guys and getting ma’am’d to death when I’m in public are not flukes.

[Mezzo Forte]

6 hours ago, butterflydreams said:

And I still think this is all a gender positive moment, because unlike previously, I’m not freaking out about this. Sure I’m stressed by it and frustrated, but I’m keeping my cool. @Mezzo Forte, I do think these people are just daft. There’s no rhyme or reason why some people get it right and others don’t. The people who do get it right span all ages. Two of the older women there are just so sweet to me. Never missed a “she”.

 

People who know me don’t know this, but I haven’t spoken in my natural register since college. It’s not the lack of endurance, sometimes it’s just that I’m tired and my voice isn’t loose yet. Like first thing in the morning. I don’t talk a lot during the day.

 

Honestly, same. All my documents say I’m female. Doctor says I’m female too. I guess I thought I could be stealth, but I’m just not there yet. I’m still kind of a baby. Not even two years full time. But still, it’s not like people look at me and have to think, “well, I guess female, but I really have to push my brain to think that.” No, even I can’t see male anymore. My face is just so different. I used to look just like my brother. Now I look like my mom. Speaking of which, if you want a chance to not hold your tongue, come to my thanksgiving in a few weeks. You can watch my mom deadname the shit out of me.

 

Thanks <3 I think that’s probably part of it. That they are pegging me as trans and I’m probably the first trans person they’ve known. I can respect that. I do know that I pass though. I might not want to believe it, but I do. Dozens of right swipes on dating apps from guys and getting ma’am’d to death when I’m in public are not flukes.

I'm glad that these moments are overall positive. Shows that you're that much more secure in your womanhood. You deserve that solid sense of self.  

 

(I'm not an aggressive person, but I have a feeling that I'd at least end up trolling the ever loving crap out of anyone who deliberately deadnames you. )