Do children owe anything to their parents - unsolvable moral dilemma

[Moophie]

@hekoppetaca1 

1 hour ago, hekoppetaca1 said:

Should. But if they didn't that doesn't mean you have to be worse or like them ;p

... I see the word 'worse' in there... 

 

25 minutes ago, hekoppetaca1 said:

First of all, I never said that you are worse. Secondly, if you become a better person than your mother, you would have the satisfaction of, actually, being better, (especially towards other than them).

Lastly, it's not worth holding grudge or seeking revenge - both of these make you feel unhappier and more depressed in the long run. Always.

Heko, where do you get off telling me how I should act? At what point do you think it's appropriate for you tell me what makes me happy? You don't seem to get just how... weird that is for you to be doing. It is fucking weird. Like, I'm not some silent video game protagonist for you to project upon and I'd like to ask you to stop. Please.

 

You keep going at this from your perspective and your perspective alone. Despite my efforts to try make you see things from mine, or basically any other.

 

And, no. You're wrong. I've never been happier in all my life than I've been these last 3 years. I don't feel bad for leaving them andI doubt I ever will. I feel free, like I've managed to drag myself out from under their oppressive thumbs. And I am proud of myself for doing so because it was a big and terrifying choice I had to make for me.

 

Now, I can only tell you these things and hope you'll understand. Hope you'll be kind enough to take me seriously, treat me like an adult who understands herself and how she feels.

 

Please make an effort to see that I just don't approach this kind of thing the same way you do. And several other people don't either. And that's okay. 

[Petra&9]

On 2/18/2017 at 5:57 PM, hekoppetaca1 said:

Do children owe anything to their parents?

Because we have in most cases only two solutions:

• child is happy, because they do what they want, they are experimenting with their life and following their dreams, meanwhile parents are unhappy, live in constant fear that something might happen to the child, parents' ambitions are still unfulfilled, parents are not listened to, are not taken as serious authorities, therefore it all leads to parents' unhappiness. However, because the child is happy, parents should be paid back, because they gave life to a creature which is now feeling bliss
• child is completely following parents' will, wishes, wants, going the safe path, learning what parents want child to learn, working in a field in which parents want child to work, sometimes even marrying a person chosen by parents so child feel unhappy, depressed, suicidal, yet smiling because they don't want their parents' unhappiness. Now parents are being given happiness, while they should receive penalty for throwing an innocent, neutral creature into hell of life

Of course sometimes child's passions go in pair with parents' ambitions, but this happen very rarely.

Sometimes everyone is unhappy, but that's a more complicated story.

This is a struggle I have been fighting all my life, no end in sight. 

I come from a stable background and had a generally happy childhood, I love my parents and they love me. Yet, or rather because of that, I always feel bound to do what, well not exactly pleases them but at least makes them not worry. It's a dilemma between me, wanting to live my life and at the same time knowing, that, to do so, my decisions will hurt my parents. It's not like they actively try to influence me or so; it's a comment here, some nagging there, those talks about a stable future (ya no, job, house, children). 

This is a moral battle inside me every day and at some times it's driving me nuts!

 

An simple example is travelling. I badly want to go to India; my parents don't want me to because they are worried, obviously. I can understand their reasoning and I guess I would probably feel the same if I were in their shoes.
So if I go and make myself happy I simultaneously feel guilty for worrying my parents. If I don't go, I put them at ease but also feel bad myself, because I can't realize my dreams etc. pp. 

 

Because of our relationship I do feel like I owe them somehow. But on the other hand I hate myself for it. 

Love is hard and it tears you apart. 

[hekky1]

11 hours ago, Moophie said:

@hekoppetaca1 

... I see the word 'worse' in there... 

 

Heko, where do you get off telling me how I should act? At what point do you think it's appropriate for you tell me what makes me happy? You don't seem to get just how... weird that is for you to be doing. It is fucking weird. Like, I'm not some silent video game protagonist for you to project upon and I'd like to ask you to stop. Please.

 

You keep going at this from your perspective and your perspective alone. Despite my efforts to try make you see things from mine, or basically any other.

 

And, no. You're wrong. I've never been happier in all my life than I've been these last 3 years. I don't feel bad for leaving them andI doubt I ever will. I feel free, like I've managed to drag myself out from under their oppressive thumbs. And I am proud of myself for doing so because it was a big and terrifying choice I had to make for me.

 

Now, I can only tell you these things and hope you'll understand. Hope you'll be kind enough to take me seriously, treat me like an adult who understands herself and how she feels.

 

Please make an effort to see that I just don't approach this kind of thing the same way you do. And several other people don't either. And that's okay. 

I didn't say anything about going back to them, making friends with them or anything, duh. I do understand you because I would leave the f*ck away from my parents and drop contact even though they are probably way less bad than yours. I simply pointed out that you still hold the grudge (i.e. keeping negative emotions tied into this memory) instead of forgetting and letting it go, so any time you encounter this memory, you feel bliss of the present instead of struggle of the past. However, it will come with time. But what am I trying to accomplish I don't know. I try in any possible way, in any possible amount to ease your pain and as always fail to do so . Gonna add it to "what did I do wrong today" list. I'm so sorry that I hurt you.

 

10 hours ago, Petra&9 said:

This is a struggle I have been fighting all my life, no end in sight. 

I come from a stable background and had a generally happy childhood, I love my parents and they love me. Yet, or rather because of that, I always feel bound to do what, well not exactly pleases them but at least makes them not worry. It's a dilemma between me, wanting to live my life and at the same time knowing, that, to do so, my decisions will hurt my parents. It's not like they actively try to influence me or so; it's a comment here, some nagging there, those talks about a stable future (ya no, job, house, children). 

This is a moral battle inside me every day and at some times it's driving me nuts!

Same. I live both life planned by them and my life. But because it's difficult and heavy, instead of being nice, I shout at them for no reason.

[Moophie]

@hekoppetaca1 omg, you're still doing it. Okay. Thank you for not taking my word about myself, 'preciate it. Glad you feel so secure about my feelings. Not weird at all.

 

Goooooooooooodbye!

[binary suns]

parents owe their kids, to raise 'em. 

 

maybe if you raised 'em well, then maybe you can claim they owe you. but let's be honest - if you raised your kids well, you'll be blessed with the privilege of their gratitude and return of investment. there'll be no need to extort them into it. 

[Correner]

I feel obligated to return my parents investment in me, however this is more due to my perception that I had an excellent upbringing then a generalized "I owe you my life"

[russtopher]

My father was an alcoholic who raised me but ultimately chose alcohol over me. My mother basically gave me to him when they got divorced (I was probably 3 years old) because her current boyfriend/soon to be husband already had two girls and didn't feel like raising another child. I ended up having to live with her starting at 15 years old because his drinking got too bad and he was getting sick. She didn't raise me, I don't have that mother/son connection with her.

 

Fast forward 25 years later. Her husband died within this past year. She is ill herself with a multitude of health problems. She has little money from his retirement and little savings. I moved in with her to help her cope. Moving in with her also allowed me to quit my part-time job and focus on my last year of school.

 

I more or less felt abandoned by both parents.

 

Do I owe her anything? No.

 

Will I abandon her when she needs someone the most?  Absolutely not.

[Dreamer23]

What? No!
They chose to have kids, and thus it is their obligation to care for them, not the other way around.

 

Now if they were good parents it can certainly make sense to have a good relationship with them and care for them like... well... the closest of family (which they after all are!). But that should by no means be based on a feeling of obligation, but rather on mutual familial love.

[PHOENIX97]

In my opinion if your parents have done the best they could in every way. I think you should support if you can. 

[sir octepus tea]

I don´t believe kids owe their parents anything but it´s a very nuanced topic. in practice, people keep saying life is a gift, and nobody can agree on which practices are acceptable with gifts. I personally believe that since you are the final owner of things gifted to you you can do what you want, and like with gifts kids don´t owe their parents anything unless they borrowed money or something like that. 

[lapat67]

Here:

http://www.resilience.org/stories/2017-03-23/climate-change-doesnt-care-about-anyones-opinion-notes-on-reciprocity-and-sacrifice/

is an article about the difference between transactional and reciprocal interaction. Although it's not about parent-child interaction I think it's relevant because it notes that in a transactional relationship where a parent is "buying/earning" actions from their children, then it becomes a zero-sum game where there has to be a balance of payment. Only in a reciprocal relationship where the focus is on giving something that is of more value to the receiver than to the giver can both parties gain.