What is your political alignment, and why?

[Joe the Stoic]

42 minutes ago, Private said:

The citizens of the USA left England because of taxation without representation.  The Dems however are presently all about taxation without representation.

 

Yeah, this isn't true.  Democrats don't try to take your vote.  That's what "taxation without representation" means.  American colonists did not have voting rights for Parliament, rights that they felt they deserved as British citizens, especially if they had to pay Parliament's taxes.  There is not a single Democrat that wants to tax the people without giving them voting rights.

 

I say again, the "taxation without representation" concept is not even closely reflected in the Democrats.  If you're really a reputable journalist as you say you are, then you should see this distinction easily.

[Guest]

if only america could tax the hookers

 

then all the deficit problems would disappear

[CaptainYesterday]

[deleted]

[Private]

2 hours ago, Joe Parrish said:

Yeah, this isn't true.  Democrats don't try to take your vote.  That's what "taxation without representation" means.  American colonists did not have voting rights for Parliament, rights that they felt they deserved as British citizens, especially if they had to pay Parliament's taxes.  There is not a single Democrat that wants to tax the people without giving them voting rights.

 

I say again, the "taxation without representation" concept is not even closely reflected in the Democrats.  If you're really a reputable journalist as you say you are, then you should see this distinction easily.

Oh my, you do not believe that I was a reputable journalist.   The dems love to hurl baseless insults, but when someone hurls one back, like Trump, they whine.  Why is that?

 

They can dish it but they can not take it.

 

Well, If you were being realistic you would realize that in 2017 the issue has evolved and the phraseology is metaphorical.

 

Obviously, if you actually paid attention during the election the people who voted for Trump feel that they do not have representation from anyone who actually listens to their concerns. 

 

The actually process of pulling a lever in a voting booth is not relevant.

 

Trump is not a Republican or a Democrat.  He is more of an independent no party candidate.

 

That is what his supporters like about him.

 

Quote

There is not a single Democrat that wants to tax the people without giving them voting rights.

Oh you won't get any argument from me on that statement. 

 

They want to give everyone a right to vote.  Even illegal non citizens because they are more likely to vote Democrat.

[Private]

On 2/6/2017 at 2:22 PM, Joe Parrish said:

Yeah, this isn't true.  Democrats don't try to take your vote.  That's what "taxation without representation" means.  American colonists did not have voting rights for Parliament, rights that they felt they deserved as British citizens, especially if they had to pay Parliament's taxes.  There is not a single Democrat that wants to tax the people without giving them voting rights.

 

I say again, the "taxation without representation" concept is not even closely reflected in the Democrats.  If you're really a reputable journalist as you say you are, then you should see this distinction easily.

To educate you about the reasons for the the American Revolution caused by taxation without representation:  

 

https://www.awesomestories.com/asset/view/TAXATION-WITHOUT-REPRESENTATION-American-Revolution-Highlights

 

For about 150 years (until 1764), the colonists not only tolerated British rule, they were proud to be British. But when the King and Parliament began to enforce trade laws and imposed taxes on sugar (to help Britain pay for the debt caused by the French and Indian War), Americans grew increasingly upset.

 

The Sugar Act also prohibited Americans from importing foreign rum and French wines. That made matters worse.

People - like James Otis - raised the issue of taxation without representation. Why should American colonists pay taxes to England when they had no representation in the English Parliament?

 

But England was just getting started with colonial taxes.

 

By the following year, Parliament (for the first time) imposed a tax (the Stamp Act) which required Americans to pay duties directly to England, not to local legislatures. The law required Americans to buy stamps for ALL printed material (including playing cards, newspapers, dice, and legal documents), thus taxing the most mundane aspects of daily life.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ThaHoward]

And that bring the question, how on earth is this relevant to today's situation? You know your history, but what you just said just disprove that it is a similar situation now as then. 

[Yatogami]

On 2/6/2017 at 4:45 PM, CaptainYesterday said:

Some good videos from Dave Rubin about "leaving" the left:

 

 

 

 

I just heard of this guy, and you shared his videos. Thanks a ton, I learned a lot about him. Great videos btw. I am glad there are other "Classic Liberals" out there speaking up. 

[Private]

19 hours ago, Tofu God said:

 

I just heard of this guy, and you shared his videos. Thanks a ton, I learned a lot about him. Great videos btw. I am glad there are other "Classic Liberals" out there speaking up. 

Exactly.  The leftist protestors are acting in a regressively stalinesque, authoriatarian, KKK like manner.   Yet it's so laughable that they can not see this?

 

As one Policeman said during one of the leftist rallies where they were hitting cops, macing young girls, setting fires and breaking store windows....."this is why Trump got elected".

 

Please note that the leftist protestors torched a Limo owned by a wealthy Muslim business man visiting New York.  They torcehed the vehicle randomly and did not care whether they were harming a Muslim, all the while claiming Trump is anti-muslim.  Talk about insanity and delusional people.

 

Also Milo Yianoupolus is gay, yet the left is intolerant of his viewpoints and the Republicans and conservatives and independents are open to hearing what he has to say.  Hmmm! 

 

 

[Yatogami]

24 minutes ago, Private said:

Exactly.  The leftist protestors are acting in a regressively stalinesque, authoriatarian, KKK like manner.   Yet it's so laughable that they can not see this?

 

As one Policeman said during one of the leftist rallies where they were hitting cops, macing young girls, setting fires and breaking store windows....."this is why Trump got elected".

 

Please note that the leftist protestors torched a Limo owned by a wealthy Muslim business man visiting New York.  They torcehed the vehicle randomly and did not care whether they were harming a Muslim, all the while claiming Trump is anti-muslim.  Talk about insanity and delusional people.

 

Also Milo Yianoupolus is gay, yet the left is intolerant of his viewpoints and the Republicans and conservatives and independents are open to hearing what he has to say.  Hmmm! 

 

 

 

I've seen a lot of people on the Left say that they are not the "Right type" of Gay person (When Conservative), Black person (when Conservative), Minority (when Conservative) as if just being Conservative is like punishing yourself, and voting against your best interest. Have they even once, pondered as to WHY these people, whom the Left so graciously defends and fights valiantly for, vote Conservative? I can tell you why. It is because the Left is unaware of its own racism, bigotry and sexism. I've seen them think black people and other minorities don't know where the DMV/BMV is. So telling them they need voting ID cards is racist. They don't see the irony in this. They are literally looking down on minorities, as if they are neither smart enough, incapable, or capable of having enough money to vote. 

[Private]

4 hours ago, Tofu God said:

 

I've seen a lot of people on the Left say that they are not the "Right type" of Gay person (When Conservative), Black person (when Conservative), Minority (when Conservative) as if just being Conservative is like punishing yourself, and voting against your best interest. Have they even once, pondered as to WHY these people, whom the Left so graciously defends and fights valiantly for, vote Conservative? I can tell you why. It is because the Left is unaware of its own racism, bigotry and sexism. I've seen them think black people and other minorities don't know where the DMV/BMV is. So telling them they need voting ID cards is racist. They don't see the irony in this. They are literally looking down on minorities, as if they are neither smart enough, incapable, or capable of having enough money to vote. 

I agree, the left is blind to their own racism.

 

They call blacks who vote conservative "Oreos" and  "Uncle Toms."  That is so rude and divisive and racist.  It's racist even if it is a black liberal labeling a black conservative with such rude  labels.

 

Hillary denigrated the women that Bill Clinton preyed referring to them as Bimbos and looney toons, yet she claimed support women and used that as a phony campaign issue hoping it would get her votes. 

 

 

 

 

[Joe the Stoic]

6 hours ago, Tofu God said:

So telling them they need voting ID cards is racist.

But when you know that black people are less likely to have photo IDs and then make laws requiring them to vote—then that's racist.  It's the same as poll taxes and literacy tests during Jim Crowe, and it's worth noting that states that have passed voter ID laws are also states that had the more repressive Jim Crowe laws back in the way.  I don't think this is just a coincidence.  The children and grandchildren of segregationists are the legislators today, and they are carrying on the legacy of discrimination in a way that is passable in the 21st Century.

[Yatogami]

6 minutes ago, Joe Parrish said:

But when you know that black people are less likely to have photo IDs and then make laws requiring them to vote—then that's racist.  It's the same as poll taxes and literacy tests during Jim Crowe, and it's worth noting that states that have passed voter ID laws are also states that had the more repressive Jim Crowe laws back in the way.  I don't think this is just a coincidence.  The children and grandchildren of segregationists are the legislators today, and they are carrying on the legacy of discrimination in a way that is passable in the 21st Century.

Um source?

 

If they want to vote, they can get an ID, just like everyone else. I do not see a problem with this. Correlation =/= causation. 

 

I think black people carry their ID more than anyone else. You know why? Because cops are more likely to pull them over and ask them for their ID in my experience. If you don't have one, they give you more trouble. There is nothing stopping them from having an ID, and nothing stopping them from registering for anything. Just like everyone else. IF they get their License confiscated, they can still have an ID card. IF they choose not to have an ID, that is their choice. I don't see why having regulations to prevent voting scams to be such a big deal. 

[m4rble]

All this concern over voter scams is just an effort to stop people from voting. 

[m4rble]

6 hours ago, Tofu God said:

 

I've seen a lot of people on the Left say that they are not the "Right type" of Gay person (When Conservative), Black person (when Conservative), Minority (when Conservative) as if just being Conservative is like punishing yourself, and voting against your best interest. Have they even once, pondered as to WHY these people, whom the Left so graciously defends and fights valiantly for, vote Conservative? I can tell you why. It is because the Left is unaware of its own racism, bigotry and sexism. I've seen them think black people and other minorities don't know where the DMV/BMV is. So telling them they need voting ID cards is racist. They don't see the irony in this. They are literally looking down on minorities, as if they are neither smart enough, incapable, or capable of having enough money to vote. 

Yeah, that's why an overwhelming majority of POC voted for Trump. Oh wait. . . 

[Joe the Stoic]

11 minutes ago, Tofu God said:

Um source?

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2012/08/voter_id_laws_why_do_minorities_lack_id_to_show_at_the_polls_.html

 

To summarize the information in the article: minorities live in urban areas more often.  They tend not to have a photo ID because they don't have driver's licenses as much.  This is because they can walk to work or use public transportation, in many cases.  Or, they just can't afford a car.  If you don't have a car, you're not going to get a license.  This is true for both blacks and Latinos.  White people are more likely to live in rural areas.  In rural areas, there is less infrastructure for public transportation, so a car is more necessary to have, and so they will have driver's licenses more often.

 

11 minutes ago, Tofu God said:

If they want to vote, they can get an ID, just like everyone else. I do not see a problem with this.

Sure, they can, but why should they have to?  Voting is a constitutional right.  Adding an ID requirement for no reason just adds a barrier to your right as a citizen and in way that impacts racial groups more than others.  That's a problem.

 

11 minutes ago, Tofu God said:

I don't see why having regulations to prevent voting scams to be such a big deal. 

Voting scams don't happen.  Investigations by Republican-controlled institutions have shown that voter fraud basically never happens.  Adding barriers to voting prevents more legitimate voters from voting than it ever will fraudulent voters.  If that is the result of a law, then the law is poorly constructed.  If you are going to pass a law, it should at least be a net gain for society.  Photo ID laws do not do that.

[m4rble]

It seems like it's actually the right that's advocating taxation without representation by making more barriers to voting. 

[Joe the Stoic]

2 minutes ago, m4rble said:

It seems like it's actually the right that's advocating taxation without representation by making more barriers to voting. 

Well, the Loyalists in the Revolution were the Tories (now the Conservatives in the UK).  The Patriots were the Whigs (now Liberal/Labour).

 

Similarly, the Republicans are our conservative Tories of today.  The Democrats are our liberal Whigs. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Yatogami]

1 hour ago, Joe Parrish said:

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2012/08/voter_id_laws_why_do_minorities_lack_id_to_show_at_the_polls_.html

 

To summarize the information in the article: minorities live in urban areas more often.  They tend not to have a photo ID because they don't have driver's licenses as much.  This is because they can walk to work or use public transportation, in many cases.  Or, they just can't afford a car.  If you don't have a car, you're not going to get a license.  This is true for both blacks and Latinos.  White people are more likely to live in rural areas.  In rural areas, there is less infrastructure for public transportation, so a car is more necessary to have, and so they will have driver's licenses more often.

 

Sure, they can, but why should they have to?  Voting is a constitutional right.  Adding an ID requirement for no reason just adds a barrier to your right as a citizen and in way that impacts racial groups more than others.  That's a problem.

 

Voting scams don't happen.  Investigations by Republican-controlled institutions have shown that voter fraud basically never happens.  Adding barriers to voting prevents more legitimate voters from voting than it ever will fraudulent voters.  If that is the result of a law, then the law is poorly constructed.  If you are going to pass a law, it should at least be a net gain for society.  Photo ID laws do not do that.

Um, the article states that they don't have IDs, because they do not want one. IT does not state at all, that they cannot get one. It also only mentions drivers license, and not ID cards. They are two separate forms of Identity. You usually need two forms of ID, to collect anything to do with the government anyways. Just because they do not drive, doesn't mean they don't have ID. The entire article is discussing driver's license. Once again, this doesn't mean they are incapable of getting a license. They just don't want one. This entire narrative is based on false assumptions, that Blacks can't get IDs. I grew up fucking poor, and still got a license because I wanted one. There is no reason for them to not have one, other than not being able to afford a car, or literally not wanting one. Its the same for literally everyone. This isn't some kind of fucking conspiracy to keep black people down. It also isn't anyone's fault but their own, that they lose their license by breaking traffic laws either. 

 

1 hour ago, m4rble said:

All this concern over voter scams is just an effort to stop people from voting. 

No, its not. That is just a conspiracy. The only people who have to worry about this is people who are illegally voting. Liberals call for more background checks and even out right ban guns even though its a constitutional right. Yet the moment you try to reign in voting fraud, its suddenly a bad thing. This is hypocritical. 

 

Also, voting ID isn't pointless. It stops voting fraud and dead people from voting. 

 

1 hour ago, m4rble said:

Yeah, that's why an overwhelming majority of POC voted for Trump. Oh wait. . . 

More minorities voted for Trump, than any other Republican. 

[Joe the Stoic]

5 minutes ago, Tofu God said:

Um, the article states that they don't have IDs, because they do not want one. IT does not state at all, that they cannot get one. It also only mentions drivers license, and not ID cards. They are two separate forms of Identity. You usually need two forms of ID, to collect anything to do with the government anyways. Just because they do not drive, doesn't mean they don't have ID. The entire article is discussing driver's license. Once again, this doesn't mean they are incapable of getting a license. They just don't want one. This entire narrative is based on false assumptions, that Blacks can't get IDs. I grew up fucking poor, and still got a license because I wanted one. There is no reason for them to not have one, other than not being able to afford a car, or literally not wanting one. Its the same for literally everyone. This isn't some kind of fucking conspiracy to keep black people down. It also isn't anyone's fault but their own, that they lose their license by breaking traffic laws either.

Where did I say that blacks cannot get IDs?  If you think my point is predicated on the assumption that blacks cannot get IDs, then you have completely missed the point of what I was saying.  Go back and re-read, please.

 

Also, it's worth noting that after passing voter ID laws, Alabama shut down DMVs in 8 of its 10 predominantly black counties, so sometimes voter ID supporters also try to make it so they can't get the IDs that they require. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Yatogami]

10 minutes ago, Joe Parrish said:

Where did I say that blacks cannot get IDs?  If you think my point is predicated on the assumption that blacks cannot get IDs, then you have completely missed the point of what I was saying.  Go back and re-read, please.

 

Also, it's worth noting that after passing voter ID laws, Alabama shut down DMVs in 8 of its 10 predominantly black counties, so sometimes voter ID supporters also try to make it so they can't get the IDs that they require. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Voter ID isn't the problem, its the Local government. Also source? 

[Joe the Stoic]

2 minutes ago, Tofu God said:

Voter ID isn't the problem, its the Local government. Also source? 

Voter ID is a problem because it's an unnecessary barrier.  Imagine if the government put a traffic cone in the middle of the road.  There's no construction.  There's no hazard.  There's nothing to block.  They just put a cone there.  Now imagine if the government told everyone who complained about the cone that they can easily drive around it.  How would the government not look like a jackass in this scenario?

 

As for source, I remember it when it came on the news a long time ago, so take your pick.

 

And yes, local government is a problem in issues of electoral shenanigans.  In fact, this is where the real mistakes happen, and voter IDs do nothing to prevent that.

[Yatogami]

2 minutes ago, Joe Parrish said:

Voter ID is a problem because it's an unnecessary barrier.  Imagine if the government put a traffic cone in the middle of the road.  There's no construction.  There's no hazard.  There's nothing to block.  They just put a cone there.  Now imagine if the government told everyone who complained about the cone that they can easily drive around it.  How would the government not look like a jackass in this scenario?

 

As for source, I remember it when it came on the news a long time ago, so take your pick.

 

And yes, local government is a problem in issues of electoral shenanigans.  In fact, this is where the real mistakes happen, and voter IDs do nothing to prevent that.

I googled it, and it says that they closed several DMVs, because of lack of funding. Alabama is one of the poorests states in the USA. There is no evidence to suggest that it was intentionally to stop Black people from voting. It was most likely they went with the least populated counties. 

 

I have a few images, one representing counties removed, population density of "Blacks" living in each county, the total population density of Alabama. 

 

 This is the counties where the DMV was shut down.  

 

 

[m4rble]

1 hour ago, Tofu God said:

More minorities voted for Trump, than any other Republican. 

What does that say about republicans? This whole, "liberals are the real racists" argument is really pathetic. 

[Joe the Stoic]

5 minutes ago, Tofu God said:

I googled it, and it says that they closed several DMVs, because of lack of funding. Alabama is one of the poorests states in the USA. There is no evidence to suggest that it was intentionally to stop Black people from voting. It was most likely they went with the least populated counties.

You could say the same about segregated schools in Alabama.  They were trying to be separate but equal.  Even during segregation, Alabama was one of the poorest states in the Union.  I am sure the black schools lacked resources due to budgetary issues too.  There is no evidence to suggest that they were trying to stop black people from learning.  Same with poll taxes.  Blacks could just save and pay the tax, if they REALLY wanted to vote.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Yatogami]

Just now, m4rble said:

What does that say about republicans? This whole, "liberals are the real racists" argument is really pathetic. 

Did you know it was the Republicans that freed the slaves, and the KKK had deep ties with the Democratic party? Why DON'T more Minorities vote Republican?...I don't know, maybe its because a lot Democrats lie to minorities and promise them everything then do nothing?  The Democratic has a deep and ugly history of keeping black people down. Jim Crow was a Democrat. 

 

http://www.wnd.com/2016/07/the-ugly-history-of-democratic-suppression-of-blacks/

[Sally]

Trump won only 8% of the African-American vote.  

[m4rble]

Just now, Tofu God said:

Did you know it was the Republicans that freed the slaves, and the KKK had deep ties with the Democratic party? Why DON'T more Minorities vote Republican?...I don't know, maybe its because a lot Democrats lie to minorities and promise them everything then do nothing?  The Democratic has a deep and ugly history of keeping black people down. Jim Crow was a Democrat. 

 

http://www.wnd.com/2016/07/the-ugly-history-of-democratic-suppression-of-blacks/

Nice try but the parties have switched sides in regards to race since then. 

[Yatogami]

1 minute ago, m4rble said:

Nice try but the parties have switched sides in regards to race since then. 

Source?

 

Also, ever listen to a Black conservative talk about politics involving black people? 

[Sally]

4 minutes ago, Tofu God said:

Source?

 

 

Source???   Ye gods, Tofu.   

[m4rble]

2 minutes ago, Tofu God said:

Source?

 

Also, ever listen to a Black conservative talk about politics involving black people? 

http://www.livescience.com/34241-democratic-republican-parties-switch-platforms.html

It should be evident that the parties switched places since Lincoln because the south now votes republican.