Shaving and "femininity" (again)

[Heart]

When we are talking about shaving do any of you have any tips about shaving facial hair/beard i mean how carefully i do it, i always end up with stubble ( if that is the right word) i wan´t to have it completely clean but it feels almost impossible.

I really don´t like my body/facial hair at all.

Chilla's suggestions are good. I will add that if you're looking for a more permanent solution (and have the money), then I've heard good things about electrolysis or laser hair removal.

[butterflydreams]

When we are talking about shaving do any of you have any tips about shaving facial hair/beard i mean how carefully i do it, i always end up with stubble ( if that is the right word) i wan´t to have it completely clean but it feels almost impossible.

I really don´t like my body/facial hair at all.

Chilla's suggestions are good. I will add that if you're looking for a more permanent solution (and have the money), then I've heard good things about electrolysis or laser hair removal.

Laser facial hair removal is a godsend. It's done so much to improve my mood, my self esteem and my feelings about my transition. FYI though it does hurt. It feels like someone snapping a hot rubber band on your face.

As for shaving, try to use sharp razors and consider a shave gel bar over shaving cream. I've gotten much better results that way.

[Kimmie.]

Thanks everybody for the tips :)

[UncommonNonsense]

"What even is a gender identity?" :P

The way I'm using it, apart from the obvious 'confuse the hell out of my pushy cis-normative refuses-to-admit-I'm-an-adult Mum' is that for me, gender identity just means the set of gendered expectations created by society that I can tolerate and live with as an agendered person and how those combine to create the way I express my agendered state. Some of these expectations, like female-bodied people being expected to wear cosmetics, I just cannot do, for both dysphoria and sensory reasons, so they do not become a part of my expression of my own personal agendered state.

Even though I was born with a female body and grew up with societal expectations of femininity, I identify as/am agender, so I find things that society codes as feminine trigger feelings of mismatch and dysphoria for me. So when I say 'shaving my legs doesn't fit with my gender identity', I'm really saying that shaving of legs, which is an activity that is seen as feminine, is an activity that I won't do because I am not female. In short, it's my way of saying "Mum, keep your nose out of my business" in a way that she really can't reply to.

Sheesh, the things we have to do just to live our lives in peace...

See the quotation marks? I was joking. I dunno why, though...

I know... but it was a good question and I thought it deserved an answer (even though some of said answer was very tongue-in-cheek). AVEN is notorious for parsing over the meanings of various words until they're all parsed-out and practically meaningless (ie 'asexual', 'desire', 'attraction', etc), so I figured my answer would absolutely not be out of place :D.

[TheStarrySkai]

I shave my underarms. Mainly cause I don't feel like sweating more than I have to. It just makes sense to me.

As for legs. I like the smooth feel to be honest, though I might miss the fuzz feeling as well. I would probably shave my legs if I wasn't so lazy to buy a razor. Even so I don't shave my thighs that much. Too much effort.

[Nylocke]

Only reason I shave my pits is because if I don't, the way I exercise I will legit sweat turmeric and smell like curry powder. When I didn't the pits, my deodorant used to quit on me all the time.

[Kimmie.]

When we are talking about shaving do any of you have any tips about shaving facial hair/beard i mean how carefully i do it, i always end up with stubble ( if that is the right word) i wan´t to have it completely clean but it feels almost impossible.

I really don´t like my body/facial hair at all.

Chilla's suggestions are good. I will add that if you're looking for a more permanent solution (and have the money), then I've heard good things about electrolysis or laser hair removal.

Laser facial hair removal is a godsend. It's done so much to improve my mood, my self esteem and my feelings about my transition. FYI though it does hurt. It feels like someone snapping a hot rubber band on your face.

As for shaving, try to use sharp razors and consider a shave gel bar over shaving cream. I've gotten much better results that way.

I did actually lock-up the price of a laser treatment and it was not as expensive as i thought it would be. It was not cheap either but somthing that i really gonna think about. The place that i checked took 2800kr (around 332 USD) per treatment session. It was the first place i found so there is surly cheaper places.

[butterflydreams]

I did actually lock-up the price of a laser treatment and it was not as expensive as i thought it would be. It was not cheap either but somthing that i really gonna think about. The place that i checked took 2800kr (around 332 USD) per treatment session. It was the first place i found so there is surly cheaper places.

That sounds pretty steep, about twice what I pay, but I suppose it could be within range of the average. A lot of places offer different kinds of discounts too. That's a good thing to look for. I did a 2 for 1 thing the last time I went, so I paid for two and get one session free. It's helpful because you save money...you're going back anyway.

[Kimmie.]

Yeah i will keep looking but i think that i will probably not find it that cheap. And you have to remember that 25% of the price are taxes/VAT on everything you buy like things/services and even more in some cases here.

[Chardog]

No idea why it is so. But perhaps hair represent masculinity? I mean. A man can't shave his arms, legs and so on. And having hair on the chest is seen as masculine and a beard. But again, having too much hair is seen as gross, and long head hair is seen as feminime, while a man having long head hair is weird. This hair for men and women are weird :lol:

The definitions of masculine and feminine hair are weird indeed. :P

There are plenty of guys that "go smooth". My shaving has nothing to do with me being AFAB- I just dislike body hair (on myself). The additional body hair is one of many reasons I balk at transitioning.

[Ruqiah]

There is something oddly satisfying about growing a full leg of hair. But that's not why I don't shave. I don't shave because it's time consuming. Time that can be spent doing more exciting things.

Or maybe being nonbinary has something to do with it. All of my other nonbinary female bodied friends don't shave either. Especially those like me who are more on the masculine end of the spectrum and prefer more neutral or masculine pronouns. I sense a common theme.

[Kazu]

Strangely enough, I've never really associated my body hair with my gender identity or how masculinely or femininely I present myself. I shave my underarms because I find it uncomfortable not to, and it's something that can be done quickly and easily. I only shave my legs every now and then though. It's a pain to keep up with it, but after every time I do so, I always think "man, I should really do this more often". Though I like looking androgynous/slightly masculine, I just really like the look and feel of shaving my legs even though I'm too lazy to keep up with it 90% of the time.

[Kimmie.]

I did actually lock-up the price of a laser treatment and it was not as expensive as i thought it would be. It was not cheap either but somthing that i really gonna think about. The place that i checked took 2800kr (around 332 USD) per treatment session. It was the first place i found so there is surly cheaper places.

That sounds pretty steep, about twice what I pay, but I suppose it could be within range of the average. A lot of places offer different kinds of discounts too. That's a good thing to look for. I did a 2 for 1 thing the last time I went, so I paid for two and get one session free. It's helpful because you save money...you're going back anyway.

And i forgot to ask this.

How many times do you have to go before the growth stops altogether or would that never happened? And how does it work do they burn hair follice or what?

Thank you for that you take the time to aswer my questions i really appreciate it :)

[butterflydreams]

I did actually lock-up the price of a laser treatment and it was not as expensive as i thought it would be. It was not cheap either but somthing that i really gonna think about. The place that i checked took 2800kr (around 332 USD) per treatment session. It was the first place i found so there is surly cheaper places.

That sounds pretty steep, about twice what I pay, but I suppose it could be within range of the average. A lot of places offer different kinds of discounts too. That's a good thing to look for. I did a 2 for 1 thing the last time I went, so I paid for two and get one session free. It's helpful because you save money...you're going back anyway.

And i forgot to ask this.

How many times do you have to go before the growth stops altogether or would that never happened? And how does it work do they burn hair follice or what?

Thank you for that you take the time to aswer my questions i really appreciate it :)

It depends how thick the hair is and how well it responds to the laser. The darker the hair and lighter the skin, the better. If you have light hair or dark skin, the laser might not work at all. They told me face takes about 7-8 treatments, but my hair wasn't particularly thick, and my results after just three treatments have been really great. I don't know that growth stops completely, but any hair that remains is very sparse.

As for how it works, I'm not entirely sure. I believe the specific wavelength and energy of the laser is transmitted to the follicle in such a way as to disable it. I think visible hairs might get burned a little bit, but it works on hairs that are not visible yet below the surface too, so burning is not the primary mechanism. And the first time you have it done, when you leave, it looks like nothing happened. It takes several days for the hairs to fall out, or get pushed out, or whatever.

[Kimmie.]

I did actually lock-up the price of a laser treatment and it was not as expensive as i thought it would be. It was not cheap either but somthing that i really gonna think about. The place that i checked took 2800kr (around 332 USD) per treatment session. It was the first place i found so there is surly cheaper places.

That sounds pretty steep, about twice what I pay, but I suppose it could be within range of the average. A lot of places offer different kinds of discounts too. That's a good thing to look for. I did a 2 for 1 thing the last time I went, so I paid for two and get one session free. It's helpful because you save money...you're going back anyway.

And i forgot to ask this.

How many times do you have to go before the growth stops altogether or would that never happened? And how does it work do they burn hair follice or what?

Thank you for that you take the time to aswer my questions i really appreciate it :)

It depends how thick the hair is and how well it responds to the laser. The darker the hair and lighter the skin, the better. If you have light hair or dark skin, the laser might not work at all. They told me face takes about 7-8 treatments, but my hair wasn't particularly thick, and my results after just three treatments have been really great. I don't know that growth stops completely, but any hair that remains is very sparse.

As for how it works, I'm not entirely sure. I believe the specific wavelength and energy of the laser is transmitted to the follicle in such a way as to disable it. I think visible hairs might get burned a little bit, but it works on hairs that are not visible yet below the surface too, so burning is not the primary mechanism. And the first time you have it done, when you leave, it looks like nothing happened. It takes several days for the hairs to fall out, or get pushed out, or whatever.

Thank you. I will keep looking in to it i don´t really have the money now. But if my disliking (don´t want to call it dysphoria yet) against my beard/mustache get worse then i possible have to take a more serious look at the financial part.

[butterflydreams]

Yeah, the financials were tough for me to swallow too. But it's spread out over time, and the impact it's had on my self esteem and dysphoria has been 100% worth it. I actually had another session just today. It really does hurt :( But even still, it's worth it.

I was thinking as I left, trans girls (heck just trans people in general) are all pretty tough. You hear me out there kids? Go you! You put up with so much. You put up with pain, physical and mental. You work so hard...all to just be who you are. You're all rock stars and you don't even know it. Never give up!

[Heart]

My understanding is that laser hair removal and electrolysis are two different procedures. The laser works best on dark hair and light skin, as Hadley mentioned, and the electrolysis works on anyone I think. I know someone who did electrolysis instead of laser hair removal because it worked better with their hair/skin tone combination.

I think both methods essentially kill the hair follicle, so not only will it lose the hair it had, it will also not grow back. Electrolysis does so with electric currents, and laser hair removal does it with lasers. But they both work in the end, so if one method doesn't sit right with you for whatever reason you can also ask about the other.

(I'm not a doctor, nor have I done either of these, so don't take my word for anything!)

[ChillaKilla]

I think since electrolysis kills follicles with a current rather than simply zapping them with thermal energy that it's more effective in less sessions. However, it's quite a bit more painful and can scar if done poorly.

[butterflydreams]

I think since electrolysis kills follicles with a current rather than simply zapping them with thermal energy that it's more effective in less sessions. However, it's quite a bit more painful and can scar if done poorly.

Yup. Think of electrolysis like a tattoo needle. One that deposits an electrical charge instead of ink. The biggest difference between electrolysis and laser is that with electrolysis, you treat each single hair follicle one at a time, and the electrologist can only treat hairs they can visually see. And it's painful. Laser, while also painful, is pretty quick. From start to finish on my face today took about 15 minutes. And that's always what I say about it, "at least it's quick". Laser can also treat hairs that are not visible. They might be under the skin, or just hard to see for some reason. The reason laser doesn't work for light hair and/or dark skin is that in order for the laser to do what it does, it has to be designed in such a way as to get at the hair (one color) without affecting the skin (another color). Lasers are light, so it's all about where you're dumping that light energy. Into the hairs = good, into your face = bad.

This is also why the first sessions are hardest, because there's more hair, and the pain comes from you feeling the energy that gets absorbed. Once you have a few sessions, and there's less hair, less energy is actually absorbed.

(Hopefully this isn't too technical, I really like lasers and stuff)

[Kimmie.]

Once again thank you for your help you are all really helpful and really inspirational people. Its a honor for me to able to talk to you all. :)

[Heart]

It's an honour to have you here too :D

[Ace of Amethysts]

An update for this lovely thread: I shaved my underarm hair today because my mum just wouldn`t stop bothering me and I figured there was no harm in shaving again once.

I can confirm that there is less body odor. Hooray?

[Kimmie.]

It's an honour to have you here too :D

It has taken me some time to figure out how i should write this answer but here it is.

The reason i wrote that is was an honor to be able to talk with you all. Is that even all crap you all have to take in your lifes and how to the society treats you all. You still take the time to answer some random guys questions how strange or stupid they may be. You have no idea how much it means for me. And for that you all have the you all have the respect i can possibly give even more than you already had from me.

You are all amazing people.

And i do not want to sound ungrateful but i can see how it can be a honor to talk to me: a confused guy with low self-esteem that really haven't helped anyone here.

[butterflydreams]

And i do not want to sound ungrateful but i can see how it can be a honor to talk to me: a confused guy with low self-esteem that really haven't helped anyone here.

Well, because many of us were once you. *hugs*

It seems like forever ago at this point, but I remember it was here that I learned laser facial hair removal was even a thing. I remember feeling scared but excited that I could finally resolve something that had bothered me so profoundly for so, so, so many years. It took me over a year from hearing about it to doing something about it.

Everybody has to start somewhere.

[Azazel]

I seem to be in the minority in absolutely hatin all kinds of body hair. I only tolerate havvin hair on my head because it can really complete the look of a cool hat. Shaving in certain areas does help with hygiene because hair can trap a lot of extra sweat in those areas, which encourages bacterial colonization efforts.

I wish I could get full body electrolysis, if it weren't for the fact that I'd still be going in for one session per week 10 years after my funeral.

[Kerfluffle]

Chalk another one up for the "No Body Hair" club. Honestly, I wish that my hair would just cease growing altogether, even if that meant the hair on my head followed suit and fell out. Wigs exist, and even though it wouldn't feel the same as natural hair I would still be happier for having no hair. Besides, a person can have as many wigs as they have outfits. Natural hair isn't nearly as flexible.

[Azazel]

Also a wig you can take off when you go to bed or take a shower, and then it doesn't get in the way.

[Heart]

It's an honour to have you here too :D

It has taken me some time to figure out how i should write this answer but here it is.

The reason i wrote that is was an honor to be able to talk with you all. Is that even all crap you all have to take in your lifes and how to the society treats you all. You still take the time to answer some random guys questions how strange or stupid they may be. You have no idea how much it means for me. And for that you all have the you all have the respect i can possibly give even more than you already had from me.

You are all amazing people.

And i do not want to sound ungrateful but i can see how it can be a honor to talk to me: a confused guy with low self-esteem that really haven't helped anyone here.

Thank you so much for saying this. I'm really glad we can help you like that. And Hadley is right; we've all been that person before, not knowing what feels like the simplest or most obvious things. We're all willing to help because we remember how amazing it was to learn the truth.

[Jiggyheads]

P

On 24/08/2016 at 0:03 PM, kimpen said:

On 24/08/2016 at 11:30 AM, Hadley167 said:

On 24/08/2016 at 9:14 AM, kimpen said:

On 22/08/2016 at 0:54 PM, Hadley167 said:

On 22/08/2016 at 7:54 AM, kimpen said:

I did actually lock-up the price of a laser treatment and it was not as expensive as i thought it would be. It was not cheap either but somthing that i really gonna think about. The place that i checked took 2800kr (around 332 USD) per treatment session. It was the first place i found so there is surly cheaper places.

That sounds pretty steep, about twice what I pay, but I suppose it could be within range of the average. A lot of places offer different kinds of discounts too. That's a good thing to look for. I did a 2 for 1 thing the last time I went, so I paid for two and get one session free. It's helpful because you save money...you're going back anyway.

And i forgot to ask this.

How many times do you have to go before the growth stops altogether or would that never happened? And how does it work do they burn hair follice or what?

Thank you for that you take the time to aswer my questions i really appreciate it

It depends how thick the hair is and how well it responds to the laser. The darker the hair and lighter the skin, the better. If you have light hair or dark skin, the laser might not work at all. They told me face takes about 7-8 treatments, but my hair wasn't particularly thick, and my results after just three treatments have been really great. I don't know that growth stops completely, but any hair that remains is very sparse.

As for how it works, I'm not entirely sure. I believe the specific wavelength and energy of the laser is transmitted to the follicle in such a way as to disable it. I think visible hairs might get burned a little bit, but it works on hairs that are not visible yet below the surface too, so burning is not the primary mechanism. And the first time you have it done, when you leave, it looks like nothing happened. It takes several days for the hairs to fall out, or get pushed out, or whatever.

Thank you. I will keep looking in to it i don´t really have the money now. But if my disliking (don´t want to call it dysphoria yet) against my beard/mustache get worse then i possible have to take a more serious look at the financial part.

Sorry, don't know why I put the quote at the bottom...duh.

[Kimmie.]

It's an honour to have you here too :D

It has taken me some time to figure out how i should write this answer but here it is.

The reason i wrote that is was an honor to be able to talk with you all. Is that even all crap you all have to take in your lifes and how to the society treats you all. You still take the time to answer some random guys questions how strange or stupid they may be. You have no idea how much it means for me. And for that you all have the you all have the respect i can possibly give even more than you already had from me.

You are all amazing people.

And i do not want to sound ungrateful but i can see how it can be a honor to talk to me: a confused guy with low self-esteem that really haven't helped anyone here.

Thank you so much for saying this. I'm really glad we can help you like that. And Hadley is right; we've all been that person before, not knowing what feels like the simplest or most obvious things. We're all willing to help because we remember how amazing it was to learn the truth.

Now when i am comfortable enough to tell anyone this i can as well say it in this thread. I am a closet crossdresser. Some days mostly at weekends i just have to dress "girly" home. And i prefer how i look in the mirror dress like that more than in default mode sort of speak. That is what is so confusing because i dont how to feel about it. The thing a like most is the shapes even do i know they are fake i just wish they were there for real. This just hurt my head sometimes.

So know it is out ther.