Relationship problem

[odradek]

So, I'm new here. I just registered, even though I've been following this site from the shadows since I discovered that asexuality was actually a thing like 3 years ago maybe.

Anyway, I've never really felt sexually atracted to anyone. I've had sex and I don't mind having it if I love my partner and (s)he wants to, but I've never quite got what the hype was about.

Now, I've been in a relationship with a heterosexual guy for the past 5 years. I was always open and honest about my lack of libido (by then I didn't know that asexuality existed, so I didn't tell him that I was asexual because I had no idea it was possible), and he always seemed to be ok with it. I mean, sex was and is an issue all the time, but we have an agreement, we both compromised, and it usually works.

The other day, however, we got into a fight. I told him that I was going to buy myself a black ring for my birthday as a symbol of asexual pride. It's kinda stupid, I know, but his reaction made me really angry. He said that it would be hard for him to accept me wearing that ring because I'm proud of how I am and for him it's difficult. I get now that maybe I was being selfish in thinking about purchasing one of those rings and didn't consider what it would mean to him, but the thing is - I am proud of being asexual even if I don't openly wear a ring or a T-Shirt or whatever. And I sort of think that your partner should stand beside you in these cases, a.k.a. when you are affirming such an important aspect of your identity. Most of the times I feel like he secretly hopes that one day I'll wake up and I won't be "broken" anymore and I'll have a sex drive, because I know that my asexuality would be the first thing that he would change about me (he has said it numerous times).

So to sum up, I think I need someone else's point of view here. Am I being super selfish? Is he being narrow-minded? Are we both being super selfish and narrow-minded? (Do tell, I appreciate honesty) Finally, has anyone here gone through the same experience or is going through the same experience right now?

Sorry for the long post - remember I'm new here.

[Guest]

You're not being selfish and he's not being narrow minded.

Generally speaking you guys live your lives in harmony and see things from (roughly) the same perspective. This is one of those rare times when your differences are sharp, pointy, raw, and exposed. Can you be proudly asexual and still be in a sexual relationship? Yup. Can you be supportive of your asexual partner and still be sexual? Also, yup. Is the reminder that your partner doesn't want you and is happy to not want you kinda ouchy on the heart? Yup. Is feeling like you have to hide your orientation for your partner's benefit kinda fucked up? Also yup.

Let me give you a (semi) similar situation. Let's say you're a woman who has only ever dated women. Your identity as lesbian has been part of who you are for decades... you've spent the better part of your life part of the gay community, working on gay rights, being discriminated against, hated, and harassed for being gay... and then, your girlfriend becomes your boyfriend and it really hurts his feelings when you call yourself gay. What do you do? Do you throw out your word in lieu of theirs? Do hurt feelings trump labels?

I don't know the answer to those questions. All I know is that two people who love each other should be able to see each other's position, acknowledge each other's pain, and find a solution that respects everyone's identities.

In your specific situation... geez, how would I feel if my partner suddenly started wearing a black ring... well, to be honest, I'd feel like she was pretty much done trying to understand me as a sexual person. I would also probably not ever comment on it because it's my personality to leave people alone regardless of how I feel, but would I feel hurt and excluded by it? Yes, I would.

[Tarfeather]

Well, you think that he should stand by you in your identity, and yet he doesn't. What does this say about your relationship?

Point is, if you love someone, you swallow the bitter pill and place their feelings over whatever sense of entitlement or pride you may have. If he's not willing to do that, if you're not willing to do that, what are we supposed to tell you?

[nanogretchen4]

I think you may have to make some choices between fully and publicly embracing an asexual lifestyle and maintaining a relationship with a hetero man. By coming out you are outing him as well, but he is not asexual. Not being desired by his longterm partner is almost certainly not a source of pride to him. You would be revealing tmi about his sex life and exposing him to embarrassing questions. He should absolutely have a say in that if you want to continue in a mixed relationship.

[Queen of Wonderland]

Nanogretchen's right; it concerns his sex life as much as yours; and you have to understand his point of view too. He's a sexual person (not ace, of course), and if you didn't know about asexuality before, he definitely didn't. If he thinks you're broken, you have to make him see that you are not, and is a sexuality, not a flaw. If he doesn't get that, and he's just holding on to the belief that one day you won't be ace, you need to make him understand you won't change, as a start. You will always be ace, which means you will always be different; and if you can't decide whether hold on to your ace pride or put it aside for your relationship, together, than it'll be a needle in your side later too.

[Busrider]

Hard to contribute anything beyond Skullery Maid's & Nanogretchen's posts.

From looking at my male co-workers and aquaintances I get the feeling it is a huge issue to confess your boyfriend's sex life in public. <- The average guy is broke and in debt, but still offering cigarrettes. He might have moved out from the shared home but tries to pass as "happily married" until the divorce is done. If he gets hold of additional credit; he'll buy a even bigger car than the Joneses.

As a girlfriend you are something to proudly brag about (maybe even non-verbally). It feels good to be envied by others for one's possessions. The envy might happen naturally if you are half decent looking. Coming out to the public as asexual might surely stop the envy and folks will belittle him. <- Pretty embarrassing.

Male cliche egos ned their pampering.

IDK what to suggest about your conflict. - I recommend to let out your asexual pride in solo activities outside the direct neighborhood's view, if you feel bad urges to do so.

But from my own experience I can only tell: It doesn't make sense and doesn't feel good among cis people. AVEN is full of quotes of those replying: "you simply haven't found the right person yet" / "nobody is asexual" and similar forms of not really understanding and accepting. - Asexuality seems as alienating as being tattooed all over + heavily pierced in the eyes of my conservative late grandmothers.

Your BF might have a hard time to tell folks: "Look what an awesome guy I must be, since even my asexual wife is compromising for me!" We could hope society grows into a direction agreeing to that but I'd worry it might harm feminism and emancipation and what about the other asexual gal? - Won't her sexual boyfriend tell her: "Odradek compromises for hers. - Whats wrong about me? Why don't you?" A huge can of worms.

As a lazy old fart I am wondering if the old approach "It 's nobody's business what doesn't happen behind closed bedroom doors!" wasn't the wisest.

[RainedMeadow]

I think I'm missing details about your point of view: how the ring helps you? Can you tell more?

I think many people in your partner's situation feel some guilt or rejection as a result of their partners being ace (it's super hard for you too, I'm sure) - and it's nobody's fault. And I'm guessing their feelings are not a flaw in their love, respect and support for you and your orientation. It's probably just a gut reaction. It's like if they loved eating bread, and you buy "bread is useless" shirts to wear every day, even the days you tolerate eating bread with them. They'd probably be like....okay, well can't you not wear that shirt so we can spend more time remembering the things we do both enjoy together? They might be forced to think "do you no longer agree to show respect for our compromise? Do you resent/reject me?"

[Philip027]

Some of you are really overthinking this. The vast majority of people don't know, and likely don't care, what a black ring is even "supposed" to signify anyway. It's just a little sign for aces to identify each other with. What is so wrong about that?

If he's making a big deal out of something like this, I shudder to think about what will happen when actual serious issues arise in the relationship.

In your specific situation... geez, how would I feel if my partner suddenly started wearing a black ring... well, to be honest, I'd feel like she was pretty much done trying to understand me as a sexual person.

I can pretty much guarantee you that any ace who picks up a black ring is not trying to send the message you think it is, and seeing things that aren't there would pretty much be your own problem, not theirs.

[Star Bit]

We can't know his reasoning in reacting that way for sure, but he may be viewing the ring as you broadcasting his (unreciprocated and partner comprising) sex life. Or maybe he reads it as you not being sexually loseable to anyone, but romantically loseable, which is almost worse because it'd be more due to him personally; that he did something romantically wrong and he fears that, and the ring broadcasts that fear. Yes, he may not like that you don't sexually desire him, but this may also bring about a needed reality check for him because this may have ended up happening down the road anyways. But yes, you're right in that your partner should support your orientation. And if they can't then they're not the right partner.

[Busrider]

I agree with Philip upon the rings' practical value. - Thats why I never bothered to get one. Anyhow I guess I should herewith congratulate your relationship to not having bigger problems. - I hope it will stay like that.

[odradek]

I want to thank all of you for taking the time to read and reply.

I appreciate the feedback, especially because it has helped me understand better what my boyfriend's thinking process might have been. I guess I didn't realise that he could feel like he was being outed too by that ring. I only thought of it as something meaningful to me, but forgot (or chose to overlook, I don't know - sometimes I can be very stubborn) that if you consider it as a public coming out, it concerns my partner as much as it concerns me. The ring, to me, didn't represent my giving up on trying to understand his sexuality but my saying to myself "I'm this way and I'm more than ok with this" after years of hearing friends saying "maybe you should go see a doctor", "maybe you haven't found that special someone yet", blah blah blah, etc. Now, if you think of it primarily as a statement meaning "I don't find you desirable" I can understand why he reacted the way he did.

So again thank you for all your opinions. You have truly helped me here.

[banana monkey]

In your specific situation... geez, how would I feel if my partner suddenly started wearing a black ring... well, to be honest, I'd feel like she was pretty much done trying to understand me as a sexual person.

Sorry for my ignorance, but can you explain why? or elaborate? personally, one of the things I like about Aven is that I use it to understand sexuals point of view. My point is the fact that I identify as asexual am now proud to do so to my workmates, family and some friends, (which has at times included wearing a ring, though that was when I was only out to one or 2 people) does not influence or reduce my desire to learn about sexuals point of view. I dont mean offense, Maybe I just dont understand correctly because I am asexual, so I would appreciate some help understanding

[MrDane]

1. It would make me, the sexual, feel awkward if my partner wore a ring/tshirt/sign or if she presented herself as: my name is... And i am not interested in sex! It also displays part of my personal sex life, since she is part of my sex life!

2. I do not understand the word:'proud'!? It is just a thing you are! You have to do something, in order to be proud. Im not proud to be tall, but im happy about it! ...im proud to be strong, because i built up my strength through hard work in the gym! Im proud, that my kids are clever and good people, even though i cant take all the blame for it!

How do you handle your sexuality, that it makes you proud?

[nanogretchen4]

Have you faced discrimination for being tall? Did you go through a long period of soul searching to realize and accept that you are tall, overcoming toxic messages your culture had instilled in you about tall people? Have you overcome your fears to come out as a tall person to friends and family members? Do you actively participate in a tall community? Have you petitioned for changes in the laws to eliminate antitall discrimation? Have you ever stopped to ask yourself how your actions affect the public perception of tall people?

I get why asexual pride is important. The problem is that being proud of a sexual orientation and choosing to date people with a compatible orientation are two great tastes that taste great together. Choosing to try to make a mixed relationship work puts some limits on participation in asexual pride activities, and that is a meaningful sacrifice. But the sexual partner certainly can't express their own orientation as fully as they would like within the mixed relationship, so choice have to be made.

[banana monkey]

1. It would make me, the sexual, feel awkward if my partner wore a ring/tshirt/sign or if she presented herself as: my name is... And i am not interested in sex! It also displays part of my personal sex life, since she is part of my sex life!

2. I do not understand the word:'proud'!? It is just a thing you are! You have to do something, in order to be proud. Im not proud to be tall, but im happy about it! ...im proud to be strong, because i built up my strength through hard work in the gym! Im proud, that my kids are clever and good people, even though i cant take all the blame for it!

How do you handle your sexuality, that it makes you proud?

Why does it make you feel awkward? Because, she is potentially (or you are of the opinion that she is) displaying your sex life?

Fair enough i suppose. I dont think I properly understand that feeling as deeply as a sexual does (or how deeply it affects them) because i am in the minority. I dont think it would bother me, other than people may think it weird, but its not their place to judge.

What I mean is, if, for example, I was sexual and decided to have a relationship with a gay man, who wished to come out as gay to our friends (which he should if he wishes and has a right to do in my opinion) that may insinuate things about our sex life (but no one will know what our sex life actually is like unless we are specific and it is no-one elses business to be honest) but why would it bother me what they think about our relationship (sexual or otherwise) particularly if their insinuations may be incorrect (but it doesnt matter if they were correct either). Its our relationship, not theirs.

I'm sure a few people insinuated about the relationship I had with my ex and thought it was weird (but that was a positive thing in their eyes) but it was the relatioship and our happiness that mattered not what was expected or thought by others.

Sorry that may have been a bit of a rant, it wasnt meant to be, I apologise.

[Telecaster68]

Why does it make you feel awkward? Because, she is potentially (or you are of the opinion that she is) displaying your sex life?

At a guess, as another sexual, because she's displaying your lack of sex life, which is embarrassing.

[banana monkey]

ok, that must just be difference of wiring between asexual/allosexual then. As i cant really understand why sexuals would find a lack of sex life embarrassing, particularly as others dont have sex lives for other reasons eg. religious belief, personal situations and other values.

[Telecaster68]

Most people would be thinking some combination of 'how weird', 'there's something wrong with their relationship', 'there must be something wrong with him if his own girlfriend doesn't want to have sex with him', and 'why on earth would she want to make such a public point of it to humiliate him?'.

[nanogretchen4]

Plus, "Is he gay?"

[Star Bit]

(^ "Is he gay or European" goes through my mind)

Also, what do you think happens when a gay person in a mixed orientation relationship (i.e. willingly settles for being with someone of the opposite sex as a companion because it's hard for minority orientations to find compatible partners) goes to a pride event; how the straight partner feels. I haven't heard any complaints on that matter, but alot of the time they also don't work out due to similar ace reasons.

[Guest]

Nice to see somebody else who knows about Legally Blonde the Musical :lol:

I think as far as gay people in mixed orientation relationships it wouldn't be any different than if I dated a straight dude and we went to a pride event. It's part of who I am and my partner should support that about me. Just like if I date somebody who is really into football. I know nothing about football and could care less about the sport itself but if they dragged me to a game then I would find a way to enjoy myself because that game is important to them.

[nanogretchen4]

If someone is going to pride because they are bi, pan, trans, or an ally, while maintaining a hetero relationship, there is no actual conflict there. If I were dating a straight guy, I would want him to be an ally. In addition to being bisexual I also have gay family members and gay and trans friends, so it's not like I would be compatible with a homophobe. If someone's partner knew from the beginning that they were getting into a mixed orientation relationship and the partner also wants to march in the pride parade, awesome. If the mixed orientation relationship happened because one partner discovered their orientation after the relationship started, I think that partner is obligated to be discreet until the relationship ends or until their partner enthusiastically consents to going public. Thou shalt not humiliate thy partner in public.

[Guest]

Nice to see somebody else who knows about Legally Blonde the Musical :lol:

I think as far as gay people in mixed orientation relationships it wouldn't be any different than if I dated a straight dude and we went to a pride event. It's part of who I am and my partner should support that about me. Just like if I date somebody who is really into football. I know nothing about football and could care less about the sport itself but if they dragged me to a game then I would find a way to enjoy myself because that game is important to them.

This isn't a matter of differing interests. Going to a football game because your boyfriend likes football is absolutely and totally incomparable to your partner coming out as a different orientation and eschewing your current relational form in lieu of outward symbolatry of a completely opposing orientation and relational form.

I don't know why everyone ignored my first post, but I stand by it. If I've only ever dated women my entire life, but my girlfriend decides to transition and become male, and it hurts his feelings because he feels like it invalidates his identity for me to continue to ID as lesbian, wear rainbow flags and "a woman without a man is like a fish without a bicycle" bumper stickers, then I should probably knock it off with the gay stuff. Because really, I am in a relationship with a man and despite the fact that I'm not heterosexual, insisting to the world that they recognize me as being lesbian when I'm actively dating a man is... rude to him, confusing to others, and ridiculously egocentric.

let's say you're an asexual and you can't deal with sex, so you and your sexual partner have a romantic, but not sexual, relationship. Let's say he only wears t-shirts that say "love machine" and "she's not quiet, she's just exhausted from last night" and other slogans that strongly suggest that you guys constantly have crazy sex. Wouldn't you probably question the motivation behind that???

[Amedot]

Great perspective Skullery Maid. I wouldn't have ever thought of it like that, but what you say makes perfect sense. Definitely a good idea to talk to your partner about this and figure out a compromise.

[Guest]

In your specific situation... geez, how would I feel if my partner suddenly started wearing a black ring... well, to be honest, I'd feel like she was pretty much done trying to understand me as a sexual person.

Sorry for my ignorance, but can you explain why? or elaborate? personally, one of the things I like about Aven is that I use it to understand sexuals point of view. My point is the fact that I identify as asexual am now proud to do so to my workmates, family and some friends, (which has at times included wearing a ring, though that was when I was only out to one or 2 people) does not influence or reduce my desire to learn about sexuals point of view. I dont mean offense, Maybe I just dont understand correctly because I am asexual, so I would appreciate some help understanding

Put simply, you're a random person on the internet, not my partner. while I understand that one can be proud of one's orientation to the point of needed outward symbols to display it while still being interested in learning about others, I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about someone in a sexual relationship who suddenly, and without discussing it with their sexual partner, starts publicly asserting their asexual pride.

Here's another example:

Let's say that you've also disliked dogs, but your boyfriend had a dog when you met. The dog eventually dies of old age. As your boyfriend lays on the couch mopey and sad that he's lost his very best dog friend, you start posting online about how dogs suck and you're super glad to never have to have a dog again. Should he stand by your anti-dog stance because it's yours and he needs to support you in everything you do, or should you maybe support him in not throwing salt in an open wound needlessly?

[Philip027]

let's say you're an asexual and you can't deal with sex, so you and your sexual partner have a romantic, but not sexual, relationship. Let's say he only wears t-shirts that say "love machine" and "she's not quiet, she's just exhausted from last night" and other slogans that strongly suggest that you guys constantly have crazy sex. Wouldn't you probably question the motivation behind that???

It's funny that you think this is at all comparable to simply putting on a black ring (which, again, the vast majority of people won't even know has any sort of particular meaning, probably won't care even if they find out, and doesn't declare or insinuate anything obscene or TMI)

The whole "macho" attitude regarding this whole subject is really absurd to me.

[Guest]

let's say you're an asexual and you can't deal with sex, so you and your sexual partner have a romantic, but not sexual, relationship. Let's say he only wears t-shirts that say "love machine" and "she's not quiet, she's just exhausted from last night" and other slogans that strongly suggest that you guys constantly have crazy sex. Wouldn't you probably question the motivation behind that???

It's funny that you think this is at all comparable to simply putting on a black ring (which, again, the vast majority of people won't even know has any sort of particular meaning, probably won't care even if they find out, and doesn't declare or insinuate anything obscene or TMI)

The whole "macho" attitude regarding this whole subject is really absurd to me.

For me, the point isn't the other people. Whether people do or don't know what the ring is seems highly irrelevant to the situation.

How is acknowledging sexual intercourse obscene or TMI? Isn't telling people you don't have sex just as TMI-y as telling them you do?

[Star Bit]

(off topic, it bugs me that none of the people in the aforementioned musical even suspected the guy was bi)

[Telecaster68]

Isn't telling people you don't have sex just as TMI-y as telling them you do?

That's the nub of it. TMI for asexuals is about things that make them feel 'ewwwww'. TMI for sexuals in this situation is about privacy.

[banana monkey]

Most people would be thinking some combination of 'how weird', 'there's something wrong with their relationship', 'there must be something wrong with him if his own girlfriend doesn't want to have sex with him', and 'why on earth would she want to make such a public point of it to humiliate him?'.

I understood that they might think that, but I dont really understand why that would be embarrassing. Prehaps its just me. I would not find it embarrassing at all. (as a side note - they would be totally wrong - in which case, although I would not be embarrassed anyway, why should I be embarrassed/ ashamed of something they are incorrectly thinking) . Not that it matters what they think at all anyway. Sorry read that again, I suppose if he felt she was making a public point of it to the point it was humiliating (which I dont think wearing a ring is as its not that obvious) then I can kind of understand it but I dont think that we mean to humiliate others just try and be who we are, so again they are wrong in thinking she is making a point to humiliate him.

replies in bold for the next part.

Nice to see somebody else who knows about Legally Blonde the Musical :lol:

I think as far as gay people in mixed orientation relationships it wouldn't be any different than if I dated a straight dude and we went to a pride event. It's part of who I am and my partner should support that about me. Just like if I date somebody who is really into football. I know nothing about football and could care less about the sport itself but if they dragged me to a game then I would find a way to enjoy myself because that game is important to them.

This isn't a matter of differing interests. Going to a football game because your boyfriend likes football is absolutely and totally incomparable to your partner coming out as a different orientation and eschewing your current relational form in lieu of outward symbolatry of a completely opposing orientation and relational form.

I dont know why, it enschwes the current relational form, the relational form is same as what it always was, regardless of participants orientation, therefore I dont think it is opposing

I don't know why everyone ignored my first post, but I stand by it. If I've only ever dated women my entire life, but my girlfriend decides to transition and become male, and it hurts his feelings because he feels like it invalidates his identity for me to continue to ID as lesbian, wear rainbow flags and "a woman without a man is like a fish without a bicycle" bumper stickers, then I should probably knock it off with the gay stuff. Because really, I am in a relationship with a man and despite the fact that I'm not heterosexual, insisting to the world that they recognize me as being lesbian when I'm actively dating a man is... rude to him, confusing to others, and ridiculously egocentric.

Ok, i get the fact that it is disrepectful if he feels strongly that it invalidates his identity, but doesnt it also invalidate yours as a lesbian? That's not fair either. I can see why you may want to tone it down a bit to consider his views (out of respect to him) but your identity as a lesbian is an important part of your identity as a person. As you did not enter a relationship with a man, why should you have to stop, expressing and displaying your identity and personality as you have previously done. Its unfair (possibly rude ) to yourself not to. I get that it may be confusing to others but thats something you have to deal with as the fallout of mixed orientation relationships. Its only confusing until you explain that it happens sometimes. ie, its confusing to others because they tend not to be educated about such things.

and on a side note, i totally agree that it is wrong to do something that you know may hurts a partners feelings without discussing it with them first, but that is not what happened here. The OP said, they mentioned it to him (which would usually then result in discussion) plus the OP sounds like they didnt realise how the partner would feel.

let's say you're an asexual and you can't deal with sex, so you and your sexual partner have a romantic, but not sexual, relationship. Let's say he only wears t-shirts that say "love machine" and "she's not quiet, she's just exhausted from last night" and other slogans that strongly suggest that you guys constantly have crazy sex. Wouldn't you probably question the motivation behind that???

No actually I wouldnt. but It depends on the slogan, I wouldnt question something that displayed his identity as a sexual (such as a ring, symbol, etc) and so i may not question the slogan "love machine" if that's what he identifies as but the other slogan suggests we were having crazy sex which I would question if it was untrue. (I add, if by any miracle we were in a mixed relationship and having sex it wouldnt be untrue and so I wouldnt question it)

"That's the nub of it. TMI for asexuals is about things that make them feel 'ewwwww'. TMI for sexuals in this situation is about privacy".

Ok, maybe i can understand it more from that point of view, I do understand the wish to keep your sexual life private, but not necassarily your identity (and I'm not just talking sexual identity or gender identity) and i suppose sometimes the 2 can unfortunately interlink, in which case it is a case of personal preference of each person. Anyway, one's identity does not necessarily have any bearing on one's sexual life as said above.