I don't really care about sex?'

[Inactive123]

First off I wanna say, I'm not asexual. I like the idea of sexual pleasure, but it only gets me going when I'm in the right mood. In which, I'm hardly ever in the right mood. But when I am, the fantasy feels like heaven.

I believe you can connect with your partner during intimacy, but... I don't really believe it's the HIGHEST form of intimacy.

To me, sex is just an activity, a game. A way to feel good. And it has the potential to be good in a relationship, because who doesn't want to make their partner feel good?

But like I said, I don't really care about it. It's really hard to get myself in the right mood. And to be honest, I don't find myself getting sexually attracted to a lot of people. Like, I'll see hot/cute people, and sometimes I'd think they'd look like fun. But never does that attraction make me want to pursue a full-on romantic relationship with them, but it would still be fun to mess with them?

I don't think sex is important at all. I could go years without it, honestly. I think a you could have a wonderful relationship without sex at all (or at least not often.) It's just a fun thing to do. That's that.

But the over-glorifying of sex alienates me so much... I don't believe sex is the reason you pursue a relationship. An emotional connection is what drives me to love someone. If they have good looks, that's a bonus. Everybody saying how amazing drives me insane. Their reasons as to why make me agree with them, but at the same time I'm here like: "It's just sex.."

People say it ALWAYS has to be part of a relationship. I can still love someone without touching them sexually, like please. But then the whole LGBT+ community just spouts out how IMPORTANT and SPECIAL and NESSECARY it is, and I feel even more alone because Im the only lesbian who cares about romance more than sex!!! How can I call myself a lesbian if I can't relate to them? >~<

I feel unconfident about relationships now because, if I get a girlfriend someday and she wants sex all the time, it's going to be really annoying- im not in the mood most of the time, and I'm afraid she'll care more about physicality than what really matters- the emotional part. What if I lose a good emotional connection because I can't please a woman sexually? What if I can't have a good relationship with a woman at all cause of this?

Love and lust are usually very disconnected for me, as I'll be romantically attracted to someone without being sexually attracted, and sexual desires won't have an actual emotional competent to it.

I already said Im not asexual (or at least I dont think I am) but seeing what everyone else says about it, Im feeling alone and broken, and wondering if a purely romantic relationship is whats best for me.

Help?

[Guest]

Frankly, I think there's a good bunch of things wrong with the LGBT+ movement, and I wouldn't want to be part of it myself (even though, being genderqueer, I would "qualify" even when you don't count asexuality among it). In my four years on AVEN, I've grown more distant to it, not closer.

Your stance sounds perfectly valid. There's nothing wrong with you. It may mean that your compatibility with prospective partners is lower than usual, even among fellow Lesbians - that's a problem a lot of aces here know all too well, and sadly, it just can't be helped, IMO. But you are just fine the way you are, and don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

[chimaera]

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[nanogretchen4]

Have you already had romantic relationships where sexual incompatibility was a major problem? Or are you completely inexperienced? If you are completely inexperienced, things could work out better than you fear. Although it sounds like you have spontaneous desire only occasionally, that's not unusual at all. You may very well experience responsive desire once you start dating someone you really like. Also, there are other lesbians out there who don't want really frequent sex.

[ellastokes]

Hey, I don't have much input, but I want to say, welcome to our community. I hope you find a lot of support here, among friends, because a lot of us here understand your experience, and share it ourselves.

The only thing I can do is encourage you. Plenty of asexual people have tons of success stories with making a relationship with an allo partner work. So many have found partners who are understanding, compassionate, and respectful of their needs, and they forego or work out a very good compromise regarding sex. I want you to know that you can, and WILL, find a wonderful partner for you.

Don't worry about words, or exactly where you fit in. Just be happy that you understand where it is you stand, even if you're not sure what word fits you best. You know what you need, sexually, in a relationship. That's great. And whatever word feels most comfortable for you to use to describe that, is the right one.

Many of you will disagree on that, and that's fine, but I think there is very little intimacy in a sexless relationship compared to one with sex in it. A QPR (or whatever it's called) is no different than having a roommate, from where I stand.

To use an analogy, the difference between a sexless relationship and a relationship with sex in it is like having two friends, one you only meet for coffee and a chit-chat and the other you do cool stuff with (go on road trips/do adrenaline sports/travel etc). Which one is going to be closer to you, hm?

I can still love someone without touching them sexually

Yes, you can. If they're sexual, though, it's likely they're going to think you love them less...

Hey, chimaera, I respect your personal needs in a relationship, and where you place value on sex. But please don't say that everyone should follow your rules, love like you do, or else their love isn't real, or as grand. Not everyone has to experience intimacy like you. No body has to value sex like you do.

Put your trust in me, when I'm telling you, some people would most definitely take the coffee and chit-chat. That is why we're all here, actually. People are VERY different from you in this regard, when it comes to asexuality/aromanticism.

In your message, there is no, "But to each their own." You're saying that the relationships we form do not have as much meaning to them, just because they don't operate like yours do, and that's insulting, because our connections are very deep, and valid.

I don't mean to come off like I'm attacking you, but what you're saying is really ruffling my feathers.

And for that second bit... well I guess it does apply for some if not most non-ace partners, and what you're saying is probably true. I don't mean to bash your realism, and encourage fantasies, but honestly? I don't like hearing such pessimistic things? I enjoy hope so much more? Why do you have to crush the OP's (and my own) hopes and dreams of finding a partner who is willing to accept a low-sex relationship? Or maybe our soulmate will be ace, an as such, effectively won't see sex that way at all.

I hate when people tell me that I'm doomed in the future. It doesn't feel good.

So all around, can we have a little more respect and compassion from you?

[Telecaster68]

If you don't wwnt to hear anything that'll upset you, best not to post on forums.

[Guest]

To use an analogy, the difference between a sexless relationship and a relationship with sex in it is like having two friends, one you only meet for coffee and a chit-chat and the other you do cool stuff with (go on road trips/do adrenaline sports/travel etc). Which one is going to be closer to you, hm?

The coffee and chit-chat one, as I like the quiet and stability.

(Poetic irony, innit? :D )

[ellastokes]

@telecaster68: Or you could manage yourself and make sure you're a bit nicer, I mean it is your choice. Unsavory behavior is not something you cannot help, or something we're powerless to change.

If it was, we'd all treat each other like shit in the streets, but instead we enforce manners, and politeness. We all decided to become accountable for our behavior, to make sure we don't do anything rude. We didn't just say, "If you don't like my rude demeanor, you should've stayed inside." No. We chose etiquette.

But like, there is validity in their statement. It is not untrue, or all that unfair to speak the truth. I just don't like to hear it, sometimes, and that's my failing.

But to be fair, there are just as many people out there willing to compromise, or give up sex, who will love you and want to be with you, knowing they are loved even though you are not sexually attracted to them. I've heard so many relationships work out.

Or you could simply find someone who is ace themselves.

It's not just, "Oh, welp, you're screwed. Give up hope. You will live a miserable existence. Your only option is to stop being ace or your partners will hate you."

[Telecaster68]

It's not just, "Oh, welp, you're screwed. Give up hope. You will live a miserable existence. Your only option is to stop being ace or your partners will hate you."

Which is why Chimaera didn't say that. He can't help what you think you read.

[Tarfeather]

Many of you will disagree on that, and that's fine, but I think there is very little intimacy in a sexless relationship compared to one with sex in it. A QPR (or whatever it's called) is no different than having a roommate, from where I stand.

To use an analogy, the difference between a sexless relationship and a relationship with sex in it is like having two friends, one you only meet for coffee and a chit-chat and the other you do cool stuff with (go on road trips/do adrenaline sports/travel etc). Which one is going to be closer to you, hm?

To describe the actual, real life situation you're trying to stamp down with that analogy: It's like the difference between a person who loves you for your personality so much, they are willing to do things they'd normally never do, just to at least try to give you what you need.. vs someone who bangs you because their lizard brain is telling them that that's a good idea.

Nothing against sexuals, but the notion that sexuality is this grand magical thing really rubs me the wrong way, considering it's implying me and all the other people who happen not to be target of sexual desire very much, are somehow deprived of all intimacy. No, there are other forms of intimacy, forms that rely much more on the human in us, rather than on primal, instinctive urges of the lizard brain.

[Telecaster68]

there are other forms of intimacy, forms that rely much more on the human in us, rather than on primal, instinctive urges of the lizard brain

There are, but they're not as primally satisfying as the lizard brain stuff. That's a big gap, the difference in eating alone when you having no sense of taste, or smell, or ability to sense a full/empty stomach vs a delicious meal with friends. It's a dislocation.

[Tarfeather]

there are other forms of intimacy, forms that rely much more on the human in us, rather than on primal, instinctive urges of the lizard brain

There are, but they're not as primally satisfying as the lizard brain stuff. That's a big gap, the difference in eating alone when you having no sense of taste, or smell, or ability to sense a full/empty stomach vs a delicious meal with friends. It's a dislocation.

Hey, no doubt about it. We just don't agree about how important that primal stuff is.

[Telecaster68]

there are other forms of intimacy, forms that rely much more on the human in us, rather than on primal, instinctive urges of the lizard brain

There are, but they're not as primally satisfying as the lizard brain stuff. That's a big gap, the difference in eating alone when you having no sense of taste, or smell, or ability to sense a full/empty stomach vs a delicious meal with friends. It's a dislocation.

Hey, no doubt about it. We just don't agree about how important that primal stuff is.

I'm convinced that's because you've never been in a situation where it's mutual.

[chimaera]

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[Inactive123]

Thank you for your replies, Tarfeather, Ellastokes, and Mysticus Insanus. It's good to know there are some people who understand, and what you've said is reassuring.

But please don't fight. >~<

And... Chimaera.. I'm going to have to kindly disagree, because what you say sounds very untrue and pessimistic... and I really don't see what's all that loving about sex, like Tarfeather said, it really is people just being lizard brains...

[Guest]

Thank you for your replies, Tarfeather, Ellastokes, and Mysticus Insanus. It's good to know there are some people who understand, and what you've said is reassuring.

But please don't fight. >~<

And... Chimaera.. I'm going to have to kindly disagree, because what you say sounds very untrue and pessimistic... and I really don't see what's all that loving about sex, like Tarfeather said, it really is people just being lizard brains...

Most of the stuff we really enjoy is. God help you people if you *gasp* go out to dinner with a date... eating, after all, is just lizard brain. OMG what about sleeping?

Tired lizard.

Cuddling?

Comfort lizard.

Talking?

Smart lizard.

Competition?

Athletic lizard.

Shit peeps, unless you do nothing but compose intricate symphonies and wire complicated circuit boards with your partners, I'm pretty sure that the stuff that most connects you is the most basic of activities. You can not like sex (or have a girlfriend who won't give you any) and that's all well and good, but please don't also convince yourself that you're somehow smarter or living at a higher level or that your love is somehow more advanced.

[Inactive123]

True. Sorry.

[Parmenides]

Talking?

Smart lizard.

Yes, those wonderful conversation with monkeys about the meaning of life.

I'm pretty sure that the stuff that most connects you is the most basic of activities. You can not like sex (or have a girlfriend who won't give you any) and that's all well and good, but please don't also convince yourself that you're somehow smarter or living at a higher level or that your love is somehow more advanced.

Also we are pretty sure that the sex-stuff that most connects you is the most basic of activities. You can like sex (or have a sex-obsessed partner who will rape you) and that's all well and good, but please don't also convince yourself that your relationship is somehow fuller or that your love is somehow more advanced.

[nanogretchen4]

KipKip, I think your best bet is to be clear in your own mind what you are looking for. If you were asexual and were looking for a relationship with no sex ever, I would strongly urge you to date other asexuals. You say that you are not asexual and that you are a lesbian. Generally speaking that suggests you are looking for another lesbian or a bisexual or pansexual woman. If your main concern is that your future girlfriend will be pestering you for sex constantly, maybe you should be looking for a woman with a low libido, which is not all that rare. If you just want to avoid casual sex, it will probably work to just wait until you've been dating several months to have sex. Maybe don't have sex until after they are ready to talk about where the relationship is going. Anyone who is mainly interested in sex will take off, but women who prioritize romance and commitment are also not all that rare.

[ellastokes]

You can complain about our language seeming to say our way of experiencing love is "advanced", and how that is unfair to you, but 2 people on this thread have hinted at the same thing about their own orientation being superior. You say ours doesn't mean anything. We say ours is pure. You can't endorse one language and call out the other, or else you're a hypocrite. Both are fine and great. It's just preference, and one literally cannot be better than another, no matter what you believe. If you think one objectively is, congratulations on being wrong.

All I'm saying is that PLENTY of people find loving and fulfilling relationships with understanding partners, and there really isn't need for your opinion, "They will not feel loved by you. That is selfish."

I don't care what it is you think you saw, in that message. I know what I read. And I, for one, advocate for being courteous to one's feelings, rather than being "realistic" and making them believe that they'll face more problems and strife, when that could not be the case.

I am so done with arguing. These are my statements. They are not up for debate. Don't reply to me.

I don't say this to be rude, I say this to assert my boundaries. I am not discussing anything with anyone.

[Inactive123]

I agree- let's stop fighting. ^^

Thank you guys so much for your help and understanding, I will keep my chin up. ^^

[Memento1]

Not having similar sex drives is an issue that plagues sexuals, too, and breaks up sexual couples. Not all sexuals have the same amount of desire for sex, and it generally does create problems in a relationship if the two have greatly differing sex drives. It's not solely an ace issue. I personally announce fairly quickly that I have a low sex drive (being that most people don't understand demisexual/asexual/ace) so people with a high-sex drive can decide if that's a deal-breaker for them.

And while it's true a lot of the LGBT+ community glorifies sex and seems to have a very high sex drive, that does not mean all LGBT+ people do. I had a gay roommate who wasn't very active in the community for this very reason, who had a bad break-up related to differences in sex drive (his boyfriend put a big premium on sex).

Also, not all asexuals or those on the gray spectrum think sex is awful. It's sometimes just an indifference to sex or at least not putting such a high premium on it. That's why cake was an asexual symbol for a long time. Sex can be related to cake for a lot of asexuals. Don't dislike it, it can be great when you have it, but you generally don't think much about it, and it wouldn't bother you not to ever have it again.

[Guest]

Chimaera - Many people would not consider that the perfect relationship, either. A sexless relationship doesn't have to look like your parents. Personally, my ideal would be no sex, sharing a bed, cuddling a lot, kissing a lot, hugging a lot and otherwise look perfectly "normal". Just, no sex at the end of it all. And I would not kiss, cuddling or sleep in the bed with my room mate. So, even objectively, there is a huge difference before you start discussing emotional significance. And yes, I have dated someone and bonded with them like that without sex being involved before. It was amazing. And I would like to have it again one day.

Though, some would prefer missing the physical affection components, which is OK too. :)

Kip - Just keep looking for someone compatible, they are out there, just find them. My friend doesn't care that much about sex and only wants it once a month. My other friend doesn't care that much about sex and he only wants it once every two weeks or so, goes years without it (though he does miss it at years without). They are both sexual. Just be honest about your needs and desires. Not every sexual is a high libido partner.

[Tarfeather]

Chimaera - Many people would not consider that the perfect relationship, either. A sexless relationship doesn't have to look like your parents. Personally, my ideal would be no sex, sharing a bed, cuddling a lot, kissing a lot, hugging a lot and otherwise look perfectly "normal". Just, no sex at the end of it all.

Yes, exactly. Anyone who sees me and my girlfriend together would assume we're in a perfectly "normal" relationship with sex and all. Honestly, sex is so irrelevant to a relationship, outside of the times when you actually have sex, and that's generally not something anyone outside the relationship will be aware of, not even the kids of the couple.

[Guest]

Talking?

Smart lizard.

Yes, those wonderful conversation with monkeys about the meaning of life.

I'm pretty sure that the stuff that most connects you is the most basic of activities. You can not like sex (or have a girlfriend who won't give you any) and that's all well and good, but please don't also convince yourself that you're somehow smarter or living at a higher level or that your love is somehow more advanced.

Also we are pretty sure that the sex-stuff that most connects you is the most basic of activities. You can like sex (or have a sex-obsessed partner who will rape you) and that's all well and good, but please don't also convince yourself that your relationship is somehow fuller or that your love is somehow more advanced.

In your extreme (and confusing) defensiveness, you seem to have missed what I was saying. My point is, what WE ALL DO that bonds us to our partners is basic... I'm not actually drawing lines, dude. My point is, that place in our brains that make us feel loved, comforted, etc, is basic by its very nature, regardless of your orientation.

[Parmenides]

In your extreme (and confusing) defensiveness, you seem to have missed what I was saying.

I should have specified that I was also answering chimaera's points while also contesting your argument based on the fact that you are pretty sure about it.

My point is, what WE ALL DO that bonds us to our partners is basic... I'm not actually drawing lines, dude. My point is, that place in our brains that make us feel loved, comforted, etc, is basic by its very nature, regardless of your orientation.

1. If it is basic, why are the animals' brains missing this basic brain's place?
2. Even if it is all basic it doesn't follow that these basic actions are equal.

[chimaera]

On 13. 7. 2016 at 6:13 PM, Tarfeather said:

 

[Tarfeather]

It's like a shared secret and that's what makes it fun for me. And I consider it part of foreplay.

Asexuals can do all that. It just doesn't lead them to desire sex.

[Guest]

In your extreme (and confusing) defensiveness, you seem to have missed what I was saying.

I should have specified that I was also answering chimaera's points while also contesting your argument based on the fact that you are pretty sure about it.

My point is, what WE ALL DO that bonds us to our partners is basic... I'm not actually drawing lines, dude. My point is, that place in our brains that make us feel loved, comforted, etc, is basic by its very nature, regardless of your orientation.

1. If it is basic, why are the animals' brains missing this basic brain's place?
2. Even if it is all basic it doesn't follow that these basic actions are equal.

I really don't know that animals are missing this basic brain's place (not sure what "basic brain's place" means, but I'll repeat your phrasing for ease). My dog sure likes to sleep in a puppy pile, just like people. In any case, we're not dogs or parrots or pigs, so what's basic for humans needn't exist for animals. Flying is basic to birds, and the fact that non-birds don't fly isn't evidence that flying isn't basic for birds.

So your argument really is that asexuals have deeper love, then? Because if it's not, your #2 doesn't make sense. If you think that asexuals love better or deeper or whatever bullshit you've decided, well, there's really no need for us to continue the conversation.

[Parmenides]

I really don't know that animals are missing this basic brain's place (not sure what "basic brain's place" means, but I'll repeat your phrasing for ease).

We were speaking of the lizard brain.

I'm also not sure what basic brain's place means but it is what you wrote:

My point is, that place in our brains that make us feel loved, comforted, etc, is basic by its very nature, regardless of your orientation.

________________________________________________________________

So your argument really is that asexuals have deeper love, then? Because if it's not, your #2 doesn't make sense.

#2 makes sense anyways because it is just a skeptical argument, the equality of these actions doesn't follow from their common source. I'm just arguing against these unfounded conclusions.

If you think that asexuals love better or deeper or whatever bullshit you've decided, well, there's really no need for us to continue the conversation.

Personally I don't think so but it is sad that the people that doesn't agree with you are excluded from your conversations.