What is really considered asexual?

[Guest]

Well, I basically agree with you - if a person's desire is near completely responsive, they practically won't even notice it's missing... unless, of course, they are in a relationship with someone with primary/non-responsivedesire. If they notice that they can no longer be "turned on" through a partner's foreplay... yes, of course that will obviously cause problems, and will likely cause themselves distress.

[Telecaster68]

unless, of course, they are in a relationship with someone with primary/non-responsivedesire

Broadly, 70-80% of men are mostly spontaneous desire; 10-20% of women are. So it's overwhelmingly likely that in a straight relationship, one partner will be spontaneous, the other responsive.

If they notice that they can no longerbe "turned on" through a partner's foreplay... yes, of course that will obviously cause problems, and will likely cause themselves distress.

The strange thing is, if you read reddits like DeadBedrooms, many of them aren't distressed; or if they are, they're in deep denial about it.

These are indicative - they just happen to have been broadcast.

https://youtu.be/_oiaDXrxs7Q

and

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07jqql8(and 3m 15s in)

[Guest]

Broadly, 70-80% of men are mostly spontaneous desire; 10-20% of women are. So it's overwhelmingly likely that in a straight relationship, one partner will be spontaneous, the other responsive.

True, but not everyone whose libido dies off will be in a straight relationship when it does. That was my point

If they notice that they can no longerbe "turned on" through a partner's foreplay... yes, of course that will obviously cause problems, and will likely cause themselves distress.

The strange thing is, if you read reddits like DeadBedrooms, many of them aren't distressed; or if they are, they're in deep denial about it.

These are indicative - they just happen to have been broadcast.

https://youtu.be/_oiaDXrxs7Q

and

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07jqql8(and 3m 15s in)

I'm not sure if you agree or disagree with me there... that seems pretty much to be along the lines of StarBit's point which you seemed to have an issue with. *scratches head*

[Telecaster68]

not everyone whose libido dies off will be in a straight relationship when it does

I was just highlighting a thing I've noticed and mentally labelled the 'AVEN some' - it's a Thing where someone on AVEN points out that 'some' people act or don't act in a given way, which comes over as 'quite a significant proportion, like 30-40%'; when in fact it's probably in the single digits of percentages: quite often it's 'some' sexuals will be happy in a relationship without sex. Some will, but the 'AVEN some' gives the impression it's in the general ball park of, say, 30% when going by posts on here and r/deadbedrooms, for instance, it's more like single figures.

The bit of Starbit's post I disagree with was conflating 'responsive desire' with 'no desire'. It's pretty obvious they're not the same thing.

My point with the video/audio was that women who had desire and then lose it seem fairly frequently (another 'AVEN some' I know, but let's say 50-60% from various forums etc. I've read) to be oblivious or uncaring of the effect this has on their partners.

[Guest]

Well, in that case... I fully agree with you, and agree with StarBit's point I delineated above. :)

[Star Bit]

If they notice that they can no longerbe "turned on" through a partner's foreplay... yes, of course that will obviously cause problems, and will likely cause themselves distress.

The strange thing is, if you read reddits like DeadBedrooms, many of them aren't distressed; or if they are, they're in deep denial about it.

Yes, they aren't distressed about themselves, but literally 90% of people who are diagnosed with HSDD are distressed because of their partner pressuring them (which doesn't genuinely mean they have HSDD). (Am i the only one that finds it kinda funny? "I was diagnosed with a disorder kuz my partner won't stop complaining.")

[Telecaster68]

You're right, partner pressure doesn't translate to a disorder. One of the criteria for and disorder, per DSM and the like, can be that it creates relationship problems. That doesn't have to mean pressure from a partner, just incompatibility; it's pretty common that the partner who doesn't want to have sex also doesn't want to talk about it, so they experience any requests to communicate as 'pressure'. That doesn't mean it is pressure, just one partner wanting to discuss something that the other doesn't.

The disorder part happens when the partner who doesn't want to have sex (and we're not talking about just asexuals here) is distressed in their own right by the problems in the relationship. Characterising it as 'my partner won't stop complaining' is dismissing one partner's needs as unreasonable.

[Barry]

A lot of what is being said here would make it seem (at least to me anyways, although it is late so I may be misinterpreting things) that sex-favourable aces or cupiosexual aces (I still don't really like that term but ehh) are not actually asexual. I think that is a mistake personally because it would invalidate a lot of people's identities.

I personally would just define asexuals as people who experience a lack of sexual attraction to others, regardless of what their views on sex are and regardless of what they decide to do based upon those views.

That being said, choosing specifically to masturbate to one person would suggest to me some level of sexual attraction to that person. That could still fit into graysexuality, but I don't think it would be asexuality. Although, I do see how some people would say that their not wanting to have sex with that person would be evidence of no sexual attraction, so it is a difficult question to answer.

If I've somehow misinterpreted what you all have been saying, please let me know. I probably shouldn't have gotten into this at 2 a.m. when my mind is somewhat loaded down by lack of sleep, but c'est la vie.

[Star Bit]

You're malinformed.

It depends on what one means by sex-favorable; as that can mean desire and not just enjoyment. Desire and enjoyment are two different things that are typically paired but not always. We are not saying aces cannot enjoy sex (think orgasming is nice, like making a partner happy, etc.), but we are saying aces cannot desire/ yearn/ wish for/ long for/ crave sex. Cupiosexuals, however, DESIRE sex (for reasons other than finding someone sexually enticing), so yes, they are NOT asexual but a completely normal sexual that consists of half the sexual population. Cupiosexuals need sex in a relationship.

Also, someone with directed sexual arousal but still has no desire for sex wouldn't be Gray-sexual in that they would still function as an asexual in a relationship, so if anything they're at the asexual end of the Gray umbrella; Gray-asexual.

[Barry]

Ahh I see. That is a fair enough distinction. I think the reason that I was confused about cupiosexuality is that I have seen several different definitions of it that, while similar, did not align that directly and specifically.

I did mean to say gray-asexual, stupid sleep-deprived brain.

[Star Bit]

Well Cupio means desire, and the person who created the term defines it as desiring sex/romance without attraction, so yah, all those other definitions are wrong.

[WhenSummersGone]

I would say yes to the last question as well since it was added after I voted.

[Star Bit]

see, you need to add context to #4

some ppl read it as foreplay and others read it as other things