Cis Woman, socialized masculine

[Ms.White]

I am totally comfortable with my body, and with being seen as female,

but I fill male gender roles in my life.

I feel more at ease, like I belong, with men than with women. I have trouble

relating to female gender roles, girl talk, etc. When I'm with women, I

naturally fill the male role (to the point of chivalry.)

I have only four friends (counting my husband) because I can not maintain

more friendships than that, as I do not take them lightly. All of these friends

are male.

I fit in with my dad growing up (an Army infantryman) and could not

relate with my mom very well. It was important to me to be more like

my dad than my mom. (I love my mom, now, don't you doubt THAT!)

I have worked male-dominated jobs and seem to prefer fields that happen

to be male-dominated.

It has been important to me my whole life to always be capable of providing

for others. I have accepted, for myself, the social expectation put on men

of being 'expendable.' I don't think that expectation is RIGHT, yet I have

accepted it all the same.

People seem to think that if you are a woman, and are obviously

visually female that you can never really be 'one of the guys,' and

treated the same way as other men. I can say that there is some

resistance to it at first (around new males) but after some time, and

constant testing by the men around me, I feel I am treated very closely

to how a male would be treated. Also, this is often the same thing that happens

between two males who first meet each other, anyway. They immediately

begin testing one another to see how they feel about them.

I don't expect that it is ever possible to be treated EXACTLY the same, of

course. But I do feel I am generally treated more like another man by men than as

another woman by women. Even though I know the men do NOT think of

me as physically male. It's more like, "I can see you are a woman, but

we will ignore that for the sake of practicality."

Contrariwise, It doesn't take long socializing with another woman

for her to notice an 'otherness' to me. Actually, sometimes in a very positive

way, as a great deal of women enjoy what is considered traditionally

masculine behavior.

I was reading "Asexual Men Musings" and was surprised how many

of the men there preferred female company, especially concerning

all the sex talk that happens in male socializing. The reason this

surprised me is that I have taken part in this sex-talk and LOTS of

shit talk the majority of my life because it is merely a male social

ritual used to test each other. I couldn't care less about what I'm

actually saying, Hell, half of the time it's robotic nonsense that I

couldn't even remember after I said it. Like, "Yo' mama."

Often, men put pressure on each other to draw out a reaction, as a way

to quickly get to know one another, or later on, as mild competition (like

a game.) It has very little to do with the actual subject being talked about

(sex, for example) and more to do with trying to get that reaction. Some

men will pretend to have all kinds of feelings/beliefs he doesn't actually

have for the sake of this. On some level, I think this is understood, and

everyone knows it is more play-acting than anything.

I admit this kind of behavior can sometimes go to dark places, like hazing.

But, most of the time, it is a harmless way to figure each other out.

Not that I have any problem with female socialization or anyone

who prefers it over male socialization. It is just how STRIKING it

is to me that I seem so... MALE...

Because I am so very, very female, really. I've even taken to dressing very

femininely recently (I have veered more androgynous in the past) because

I am rewarded for it by society. People react to me more positively IMMEDIATELY

the more my appearance matches my body to them. Considering a person goes

through life having MILLIONS of interactions with other people that last only seconds

to minutes, this is very beneficial to me. Plus, I have always loved make-up. I'd be

an eyeliner wearing guy.

Also, I think it is unfair to say that women are more emotionally accepting

than men, because I've found men to be just as accepting as women on

average!

Humans are just not all that accepting in general. There are, of course,

some much more accepting than others, but I think there is equal likelihood

of that from men or women.

Men just are expected to take part in more aggressive social rituals, but it is

FAUX aggression the vast majority of the time. As well as having more stringent

social expectations on how they "should" express themselves. But that does not

mean they are actually any less accepting of what is being expressed.

I do think men and women are more alike than people think. But socialization

is a difficult thing to overcome. I'd say I'm living proof of both of those statements.

Ah, hell, maybe I'm just all wrong and confused. Oh well. Fuck it.

[Emery.]

I'm quite similar. I'm circling in male-dominated fields and always find the manly thing to do, I have manly interests, relate to my dad much better, my google ads think I'm male, I even talk sex with guys. And women threw me out of football team for no reason :/ Many of them hate me for no reason. And I end up opening doors for them. What the hell... You're supposed to need the company of women for some reason I don't know, I need the company of men... Even the body is supposed to feel different but doesn't.

One difference though, if I dress feminine, I receive hostility, because I fire off a big alarm of contrasting look and behaviour. I get teased for dresses and make-up, I sometimes read what it's supposed to be to be female in this society and doubt myself. I was told my whole life to behave more girly, I spent most of my life with women... And this all... I don't know what to think. It's not supposed to happen.

[EmotionalAndroid]

Wow, I actually had been considering posting something similar to this recently! I'm cis-female and have been in a male-dominated field for so long that I feel really out-of-place alongside other women. All my interests are by far more "masculine" and I don't associate at all with female stereotypes, aside from how I have been taught to behave. To be honest, women really intimidate me.

However, unlike you I have been afraid to act more masculine because of my fear of the consequences socially. I've always been shy, quiet, polite, and conservative (not politically, but just in general). It's just how I was taught to act, being "a girl," and I've just gone along with it. But seeing males interact makes me really want to act in a similar manner.

It is my ultimate desire to have male platonic friends and for them to treat me like just "one of the guys" truly and honestly. I've always thought it could never happen, but your post has given me hope that it can. I'm so glad to hear that you have had relationships like this. :) Maybe I just have to cut loose a bit and act how I want, not how I think I should because I am physically female.

[Emery.]

Wow, I actually had been considering posting something similar to this recently!

I was writing such a topic at the very same moment!

Maybe I just have to cut loose a bit and act how I want, not how I think I should because I am physically female.

Good idea :) I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you.

As for platonic friends with men, I have plenty of those :P

[SithLord]

I do think men and women are more alike than people think. But socialization

is a difficult thing to overcome. I'd say I'm living proof of both of those statements.

I had an entire sociology class centered around that idea. Men and women are more alike as groups than individuals in those groups.