Question: Society, School

[Luisa]

I am interested in knowing people's personal opinions on this idea which has struck to me on numerous occasions:

It would seem fairly obvious that society is, in some way, uncomfortable with asexual people. I am basing this upon the fact that, even though sexual practices such as homosexuality are "moving into the mainstream" of social consciousness, there are still many people who are uncomfortable with ~that~ aspect of sexuality. In light of the fact that asexuality is talked about much less, I would figure that the same people who were uptight about the different practices of same-sex partners would also be non-understanding, as a whole, and perhaps even judgmental of the "abarrancies" of an asexual individual. (I realize that this is mainly presumption on my part.)

But assume it's true, for now: society is uncomfortable with asexual people, and is becoming even more so as "celibate/asexual" priests are exposed as child-molesters.

Do you suppose that it could be because society feels threatened, GREATLY, by the asexual individual?

I will explain why they might feel threatened: it appears that the vast majority of society is, in one way or another, so very wrapped up in their sexual lives and identities that it becomes one of the factors that "control" their lives. For instance, "Am I going to go to the beach with friends today, or is there a chance that if I stay at the house, he/she will call, and sex might result?"

If you are a person who is that dependent on sex, doesn't it seem likely that those who are NOT dependent on sex for a happy life would seem to posess a freedom from being controlled by their bodies and urges? Perhaps, on a conscious or subliminal level, they wish, too, that they could be "free" from the strong urges of their bodies.

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I quickly wanted to mention that, while I was taught "Sex Ed" in school, it was never presented in a "balanced way." Perhaps this impacted me.

The teachers taught us all about diseases, and pregnancy, and how "young boys use girls for sex," and all of the negatives...but not ONCE did I hear ANYONE say EVER, "Sex is something that is usually enjoyable to most people, at the right time."

Has anyone here ever had a sex ed class while growing up that emphasized ANYTHING positive about sex?

I was left at a young age with a deep feeling of "good" people don't have sex, because of all of the reasons given to me in sex ed.

[nemesis]

I'm not sure that as many people would be as uncomfortable with asexuals as they are with homosexuals. Homosexuals, after all, are noticeable by their actions and therefor heterosexuals are directly confronted with them. Knowing a person is asexual is an easier thing to forget since lack of action is a great deal less noticeable. I believe that a great deal of the reason that asexuality is not dealt with by sexuals is that they don't actually know it exists and seem to have difficulty accepting the concept is possible even when they are told.

That said, I think you propose a very interesting theory. There have been people who have come to this board who said that they wished they weren't sexual. I'm sure there is something very tempting about the seeming free time and lack of complication of an asexual (though in reality "uncomplicated" is certainly nothing more then an illusion).

Sex ed is a bit scary. If you're paying attention. I spent most of that time drawing in my notebook. Except when the lights were out and they played horrible films about diseases and giving birth that are apparently meant to make a sexual person less likely to be active and a non-sexual person rather ill. When I was younger I did have the much more positive view from my parents though. They had five children and believe that the meaning of life is basically held in reproduction. Which makes me, being what I am, in a rather awkward position. I haven't told them yet, maybe I'll get around to mentioning it in, oh 7 years or so, when they're starting to get the idea on their own and I hopefully have nieces and nephews around who can soften the blow.

[Luisa]

Dear Nem:

I've been thinking about your situation, and your concern with eventually telling your family of your asexuality, in light of their view on life: life exists to create more life.

I don't know if these suggestions will help any, but it's what came to mind, and I thought it probably couldn't hurt.

1. The idea to wait until they might be getting ideas on their own, I think, is a good one. This is, in a way, "preparing" them, even through ~not~ discussing it.

2. You might not want to be extremely "cut and dried" about your approach and terms. It sounds very different when you say, "I am asexual," than when you say, "Y'know, I just really don't like sex. I think babies are great, and I love my nieces/nephews, but the sex part just isn't for me." The first is more like a declaration, and the second, more like a conversation. (People can get scared by "labels" like "asexual.")

3. If your family is religious, you are probably in a better spot than if you had to tell them that you are homosexual (for instance.) Incidentally, I don't know your "identity," but if you ~are~ homosexual AND asexual, there is no reason to discuss the homosexuality part, because it's a moot point, and also, a private part of your life. Anyway...as far as religion goes, there are some passages in the bible that are often read as condemnation of homosexuality. However, a lack of sexuality is usually equated with being pristine, pure, "Christ-like," etc. If you tell them after waiting awhile, they may be "afraid" that you are going to tell them you are gay, and then be "relieved" that, in fact, you simply don't care for sex.

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Gotta run right now - sorry. I did not have a chance to read this post over and make sure that everything was worded in the most inoffensive way. Hope I didn't offend, or touch on matters that are too private.

Obviously, I don't "condemn" any kind of sexual orientation (etc.) and this includes people who are ~very~ sexual creatures.

I hope you understand. Really gotta run. 'bye!

[Eta Carinae]

Regarding society feeling uncomfortable: heck, I've known individual people to be uncomfortable. I once saw a post on a bulletin board literally saying that asexuals were creepy. I agree that this discomfort is more widespread than it ought to be, but I doubt that most of it is because of buried envy. Some of it, maybe, but not all. I think that it's more an expression of the built-in aversion human beings seem to have to things that are (or appear to be) unhealthy or abnormal. People with horrible deformities are kinda creepy at first glance, ya know? And while asexuality certainly doesn't generate the same level of discomfort that having an eye in the middle of your forehead does, most people still view it as abnormal. Thus, it disquiets them. (Indeed, the woman who was creeped out said that it was because asexuality wasn't normal.)

As for sex ed in school: I actually recall having a few semi-positive classes (at a Catholic high school, no less!). They didn't emphasize the positive, but they weren't condemnatory about it, either.

[Luisa]

I.B.:

After thinking it over, I have decided that you are probably right about society. All along, society has rejected, or at least been made extremely nervous by ~anything~ "different." In the fifties, it was rolled up jeans cuffs, black leather jackets, and hair gel. In the sixties, it was hippies. And so on. Whatever stands out like an eye in the middle of your forehead will probably produce a reaction. Good call on your part.

:)

I'm happy to hear that at least ~someone~ managed to have some Sex Ed classes that weren't horrific! Hooray for your Catholic High School! (Very unexpected that it would come from a strictly religious place, but then again, perhaps they put more thought into their curriculum for that very reason...)

Take Care!

[Cosmos]

People love to pigeon hole people almost as soon as they meet them. The comment above along the lines that "all homosexuals are obvious..etc" for example is insulting and an example

People of all chosen sexualities and asexuals are free thinking individuals first

and foremost. "Actions" do not make a gay person gay, or a straight one, straight

and the same goes for all variations across the spectrum. We are what we are.

Sex education at school for me also consisted soley of photos of diseases,

all of the class were assumed to be

heterosexual and monogamy, marriage and children were offered as the only "acceptable lifestyle". I am not knocking those who willingly fullfil all these identities and are happy.

Asexuality is seen as a threat because it is

a personal choice. It may be seen as "selfish". It denies "procreation" and if you have ever been to a wedding service you'll have heard that no sooner are rings exchanged than the rector/vicar/minister

is instrructing the assumed heterosexual couple to copulate as soon as possible.

To a large extent society is distrustful

of the individual - the person who does not instantly "fit in". I would argue that,

with a few exceptions most individuals who have chosen to be asexual and who are gay or bisexual are normally "invisible". Websites such as this,

which we haven't found by accident, give us the opportunity to express identity,

to discuss, to empathise and to "stand out from the crowd". Sex is generally

assumed as being the ultimate experience, we disagree. For lots of people sex is very important at all sorts of levels and what sexual people find difficult to understand is that for other people with low/no libido sex is either

undesirable or/ and unachievable.

I find it very interesting the way impotence is addressed; try using a search engine and you'll come across loads of "sympathetic" and "helpful"

websites all geared to restoring vigour and manliness. No one seems to realise or

own up to the fact that one can find it can be a pleasure.

[Legolas]

I had to watch a live birth in sex ed i still don't know how i managed not to puke or pass out. It has got to be the single most disgustign thing i have ever seen.

But they did tell us that out of the fathers who go and watch this 2 thirds pass out.

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Sex ed cannot ENCOURAGE ppl to have sex. Why? cause it's in a school and parents woudl scream if their 16 year old was encouraged to do it. They warn us about the diseases the pregnancy but that is about it. I was never once told NOT to do it but I was made aware of the risks and ways to protect myself ha not like i will ever lose my virginity anyway.

Cosmos not sure when u went to school but sounds liek this is the "old style" the kind of things they USED to teach ppl in school. I am 19 just got out of school and i can say (save for the disgustign videos) that the course was quite good. Not that i will ever use the info there but it was taught in a cool way imo and we had a great teacher.

Alex

[nemesis]

Cosmos- "The comment above along the lines that "all homosexuals are obvious..etc" for example"

That is about my comment? I didn't say all of them were. But some of them ARE.... and obviously so. As long as there are any homosexuals having relationships in the open (doing things such as kissing in public and such) then the heterosexual community is confronted with the issue.

On the other hand if an asexual is in the street kissing the opposite sex then they're likely to be seen as straight, if they're kissing the same sex then they'd be perceived as gay, if they're not with anyone then they're just a person going somewhere alone. There's no reason for asexuality to ever cross anyone's mind. Which is what I was saying.

[aury]

i learned about sex ed when i was 4th grade, then it all went downhill onto high school. in 6trh grade, we watched videos about births, & there was no censorship whatsoever. in fact, our hippy bitch of a science teacher told the girls, "girls, this is gonna change your mind about having kids!!!" by the end of class, all of the girls were running towards the bathrooms, holding their stomachs, pale as hell (of course i was one of them). i don't exactly remember the extent of what was taught in any of the grades, but i know that it had an effect on me. in fact, it was in my 10th grade health class that i learned about asexuality. hell, i even bragged that i was one once i learned the name.

my mother never talked to me about sex, i guess it's because she was either too shy or because she figured that school would take care of it. in fact, one day she barged into my room & said, "you & i are gonna talk about drugs," to which i said, "maaa, i already know about drugs." her reply? "i know, tell me about them."

lucky for her i'm not interested in sex whatsoever. maybe she figured that out when i was a kid? hmmm.........

[Cosmos]

Legolas, you are right it was back about

1971 when I had my brief school sex lessons. In some ways thing are even crazier now. During the Thatcher era a law

was passed known as "section 28" prohibiting all school teachers and schools from making any positive comments on "gay lifestyles". AIDS education goes on in a vacuum and young people who are not 101% secure in their own sexuality, will, I think not gain

any permitted insight in school to "other lifestyles". Our Labour government has

made some positive inroads but this law

is still on the UK statute-book; so the

media has a responsibility to give accurate

information and show some positive role-models.

Nemesis, I take your point on board completely although here in the stiff upper lipped UK it is very rare to find anyone showing affection in public!

If only we had more Latin blood in us.

I think one can be tactile and still be asexual, do you agree?

[geekalious]

I saw a woman give birth too! EEK! I did throw up though! It was so freakin' gross!

I do love children though and plan to adopt.

[VivreEstEsperer]

Aury, your sex ed actually talked about asexuality?? WOW! How did they do it, what did they say? That's amazing to me. i wish mine had done that! -i wish all sex ed programs talked about diverse sexualities or lack thereof.

Kate

[ogbg]

Eww!! I've never seen a live birth and hopefully I never will :shock: All the same, sex ed was AWFUL!!! As if I needed to know what a naked guy looks like!!! (pukes)

Speaking of "discouraging teens from having sex", did you read that Oddly Enough news article in Reuters? The one about sex ed teachers encouraging students to give blow jobs instead of having intercourse if they were in an intimate situation? YEEEECH!!!! :x

[Orpheus]

Live births are weird man.

What gets me is that I have never onced questioned somone as to why they have sex. Yet they always question me as to why I don't. SO the other night when somone asked me, I asked them why do they have sex. His exact words were

"I don't know...It's just expected of me."

Now that's fucked up in every possible way shape and form.

[VivreEstEsperer]

You got that right.... it's a fucked up society for sure.

[Skiddaloxx]

Orpheus, where did you find the courage to be so open with everyone about your asexuality? *ready to take notes*

Skiddaloxx

[Orpheus]

Why do yoiu hide it?

they know we are here, they just don't want to admit it. Also I' do things in a respectful manner, they have their lifstyle and we have ours, to each his own.

Of coarse the second somone calls me a freak or a sexless queer, it's on, but after the other night i don't think to many ppl here will be bothering me.

By the way, I don't tolorate ignorance.