Question about sex enjoying aces?

[ImaUnicorn]

So, my understanding of asexuality as a movement and identity is that is has been formed for people who don't like sex- normally defined as people who do not experience sexual attraction. This is understandable because society today is saturated with the idea that everyone loves sex and people who are asexual may feel alienated or like they don't fit in. The point of asexuality, to me, is to say that it's okay not to like sex. There are people like that and they are called aces/asexuals. Nothing is wrong with them, they are just born that way.

But there is a part that confuses me. I've heard people talk about three kinds of aces in regard to their feelings about sexual intercourse. One is sex repulsed or sex averse, which is how I am. Of course, sex repulsions/aversion varies from just thinking sex is gross to feeling sick over sexually explicit content in jokes, conversation, or media and entertainment. I'm one of the people that feels sick, sometimes, over these things. Anyway, the other kind, which I can also understand, is sex disinterested or sex indifferent aces. These are people who don't think it is gross but may find it boring or see no point in it. There is no pleasure or drive in it for them. The third kind, sex enjoying asexuals, is the part where I get confused.

My question is, if someone is asexual, and that means they don't experience sexual attraction, wouldn't that mean they don't like sex? If someone identifies as sex enjoying, however, then how do they know they are asexual? How is being a sex enjoying asexual different from being a heterosexual, or a gay, or a bisexual person. I am not trying to be elitist or anything. I just want to understand.

[Nashira]

Well, I think it's something that varies from person to person. I consider myself in the middle group - I find it boring, usually a bit disappointing. Still, I'm not sure I would call it completely not pleasant.. I'm romantic and currently in a relationship, so being intimate is nice for me - I just don't like sex as much as the regular person. Also, I like seeing my partner happy, so I wouldn't say I see no point in it. Basically, it's not that I don't feel any pleasure having sex - it's just that most other things are more pleasurable for me, lol. I'm not sure if this was the kind of answer you were looking for, though (I'm also curious to see other's opinions)

[deltaX]

I'm a sex repulsed/averse ace, so I might not be the best person to answer your question, but I'll do my best.

Basically, being asexual only implies a lack of sexual attraction and/or a lack of intrinsic desire for partnered sex. This definition means that someone could enjoy sex for whatever reason, but still identify as asexual because they don't feel any attraction or desire to do it with a specific person or gender.

A few reasons I've seen for asexuals liking sex is that they enjoy making their partner happy, they enjoy the psychical sensation, or they use it to get rid of their libido (which can be different from sexual attraction). People might not be sexually attracted to anyone, but still fall into one of those categories, and those people sometimes identify as asexual.

Don't worry if it all seems confusing at first; as a fellow sex-repulsed ace I was very confused by sex-favorable aces when I first joined AVEN as well. Hopefully some of the responses here though will help to clear up some of the confusion! :cake:

[Rising Sun]

Being asexual is quite different from being sex-repulsed in itself. There are very sexual sex-repulsed persons. It isn't paradoxical sometimes to crave something you hate. Have you ever seen a smoker who hates smoking but who is always tempted to smoke because he needs his cigarette ? This is exactly what I'm talking about.

OTOH, there are people who are never tempted to smoke but who don't refuse a cigar if offered to them and enjoy it.

[Hobbes!]

In any case, there are ways to enjoy sex without sexual attraction. If you love the person you're with it can be enjoyable to see them and make them happy, for example, even if you wouldn't seek out sex for it's own sake

[Shovels]

Have you ever enjoyed watching a movie or read a book . And then had absolutely no need to ever watch or read it again.

I've personally felt like that with tons of things. It was totally great but I'm perfectly fine and happy if I never see/watch/read it again.

I think it's a bit like that.

But when there is attraction involved you need or want to watch the movie again.

I hope that made some kind of sense.

Edited February 1, 2016 by Shovels

[Velma]

Excellent things here. For me, it's like this. If no one ever suggests sex at all, I never think about it. I never get any urges at all. I don't have say need or desire for solo sex, either. I just turn into a rock or something. Nada.

If my husband wants sex, I'll try to avoid it most of the time. I need to psyche myself up for his sake. It's not that I'm repulsed, I just see it as a waste of time and I'd rather be doing something else. However, once I do finally relent, I have a pretty good time. I'd say that I enjoy it, to some extent. I'm fairly certain sexual folk get something more exciting out of it than I do though. Because as fun as it is, I'm not sorry when it's over.

This is terrible, but as much as I love my husband I'll look at my watch afterwards and say, "Yay! That didn't take too long! I have time for one mor chapter of this book before bed!" Which I'm SURE isn't what most wives think after sex with their husbands. But I'll still say it's not horrible. Maybe if I were immortal and had no need to sleep or eat and I had the ability to make time stand still, I'd seek it out myself now and then. But as it is, there's limited time and I'd rather be doing other things. (Just thought about it, and no.. I wouldn't seek it out. But improbably wouldn't try to avoid it as much.)

[Star Bit]

[toward asexuality] people who don't like sex- normally defined as people who do not experience sexual attraction

Incorrect. One, asexuals can sexually compromise and even enjoy sex, they just don't desire it. Two, sexual attraction is not defined by enjoying sex, it is when something about someone triggers the impulse to have sex with them.

[toward sex indifferent asexuals] There is no pleasure or drive in it for them.

That depends. For one, there is sexual pleasure and emotional pleasure. Both of which asexuals can feel, they just don't desire sex even with being able to feel those benefits from it. And two, some sex indifferent asexuals are indifferent while having sex, while others may enjoy it while it happens but are still indifferent otherwise (before or after it).

But your question is how asexuals can enjoy sex. There are many reasons. Some can enjoy just orgasming, some can enjoy making their partner happy, others enjoy the bond increase from it, etc.

[Shovels]

It may be more accurate to say the third type would be sex positive instead of sex enjoying. Because as Star Bit said even sex indifferent asexuals can enjoy sex.

[Philip027]

As ace-contrary as it might seem, I don't necessarily start to (mentally) salivate when I see cake.

However it doesn't mean that I won't enjoy eating the cake. I'll probably even like it. I don't necessarily have to be craving cake to be able to enjoy it.

To me, it's one thing to be able to enjoy something; it's another to actively pursue it. Chances are, you don't necessarily pursue every single thing you enjoy doing; there's probably things you might like but have more of a "take it or leave it" approach to it overall.

_{P.S. there is only one day of the year where I expect to have cake, and that's on my birthday. huhuhu~}

[Guest]

It may be more accurate to say the third type would be sex positive instead of sex enjoying. Because as Star Bit said even sex indifferent asexuals can enjoy sex.

No, that would be less accurate. Sex-positive means something else entirely; people can be completely sex-repulsed to the point of never, ever, ever wanting to even think about having sex, themselves, but be still very much sex-positive.

Sex-positive means that you are in favor of people, in general, being free to choose how much or how little sex they want to have in their lives (as long as it's all safe, sane, and consensual), and considering SSC sex to be something that is not generally and inherently bad. Sex-positive, thus, is the opposite of antisexual, not the opposite of sex-repulsed.

[levelskid]

I'm indifferent, but asexual does not mean no like sex. There's just no desire, but we have pleasurable nerve endings or whatever like sexuals so it is possible to enjoy sex. I thought that because I wasn't repulsed that I wasn't asexual. I just thought the other boys made a bigger deal out of it, and since I masturbate (though it's more work than it's worth) and have fantasies, I thought wasn't one. Seven years later I and probably many others found out what asexual really was, and came to the realization that we were.

[Shovels]

It may be more accurate to say the third type would be sex positive instead of sex enjoying. Because as Star Bit said even sex indifferent asexuals can enjoy sex.

No, that would be less accurate. Sex-positive means something else entirely; people can be completely sex-repulsed to the point of never, ever, ever wanting to even think about having sex, themselves, but be still very much sex-positive.

Sex-positive means that you are in favor of people, in general, being free to choose how much or how little sex they want to have in their lives (as long as it's all safe, sane, and consensual), and considering SSC sex to be something that is not generally and inherently bad. Sex-positive, thus, is the opposite of antisexual, not the opposite of sex-repulsed.

Good to know. :)

[Telecaster68]

The key concept here is 'innate'. Asexuals don't have any innate drive or need for sex the way sexuals do. Some don't mind doing it for their partners' sake of to get pregnant or whatever, and maybe even enjoy it but left to themselves, they'd be fine never having sex ever again.

Velma - I'm curious. If you know you'll enjoy sex, why try to put it off? Especially as it means a lot to your husband.

[Tarfeather]

I always think that I could enjoy sex with a man if I really put my mind to it; So why shouldn't asexuals be able to enjoy sex? Just the fact that you're not sexually attracted to someone doesn't automatically mean you couldn't ever enjoy sex with them.

[Tarfeather]

Excellent things here. For me, it's like this. If no one ever suggests sex at all, I never think about it. I never get any urges at all. I don't have say need or desire for solo sex, either. I just turn into a rock or something. Nada.

If my husband wants sex, I'll try to avoid it most of the time. I need to psyche myself up for his sake. It's not that I'm repulsed, I just see it as a waste of time and I'd rather be doing something else. However, once I do finally relent, I have a pretty good time. I'd say that I enjoy it, to some extent. I'm fairly certain sexual folk get something more exciting out of it than I do though. Because as fun as it is, I'm not sorry when it's over.

This is terrible, but as much as I love my husband I'll look at my watch afterwards and say, "Yay! That didn't take too long! I have time for one mor chapter of this book before bed!" Which I'm SURE isn't what most wives think after sex with their husbands. But I'll still say it's not horrible. Maybe if I were immortal and had no need to sleep or eat and I had the ability to make time stand still, I'd seek it out myself now and then. But as it is, there's limited time and I'd rather be doing other things. (Just thought about it, and no.. I wouldn't seek it out. But improbably wouldn't try to avoid it as much.)

Wait, do you feel the same way about masturbation? If so, that sounds like a result of low libido, rather than of asexuality.

[jay williams]

I guess asexual means different things to various people. The usual definition is a person who experiences no sexual attraction. Now, that is less than clear for me. What is sexual attraction?

For me, asexual means no desire or yearning for sexual intercourse. No matter what, I have no desire for penis-in-vagina activity. Some call it penetration. I have no desire for it. I do find women attractive, and I do have a libido. I don't have any desire for intercourse. It is an activity that has no appeal for me. Moreover, it mystifies me to a large degree why others consider it a big deal.

[Velma]

Jesus Christ, Tarfeather.

[Tarfeather]

Jesus Christ, Tarfeather.

o_O

[Lixt]

Enjoying or not enjoying sex isn't necessarily black and white, either.

I've used the cake metaphor before knowing AVEN, though I used the example of food in general, dessert in particular. I've never understood dessert, eating a treat after you've already had a full meal, what a waste. Anyway, sometimes you're at certain gatherings and dessert is normal and guests won't be asked whether they want dessert or not, the plates just arrive and everyone has a slice and it's all normal. You have wedding cake at weddings, birthday cake at birthday parties, it's expected.

And on some occasions (lots of guests), you can just push the plate towards someone with a bigger appetite, but on others, especially if the dessert is homemade, it's more complicated to be socially graceful. Be a complete doormat and eat the whole thing with a smile and compliments to the cook, just flat out refuse or argue for the tiniest slice "just to have a taste"?

Eating the cake when you already feel full, it can still taste good in your mouth (altough probably not as good as if you were actually hungry) and be a different story in your stomach, leaves you feeling bleh for a few hours etc.

Part(s) of something can be enjoyable while still being a discomfort/not enjoyable as a whole. It's really not black and white.

[Star Bit]

I guess asexual means different things to various people. The usual definition is a person who experiences no sexual attraction. Now, that is less than clear for me. What is sexual attraction?

For me, asexual means no desire or yearning for sexual intercourse. No matter what, I have no desire for penis-in-vagina activity. Some call it penetration. I have no desire for it. I do find women attractive, and I do have a libido. I don't have any desire for intercourse. It is an activity that has no appeal for me. Moreover, it mystifies me to a large degree why others consider it a big deal.

The sexual attraction definition only became popular because AVEN became the main site for asexulity; which was not the creator of this site's intent. He also dictated the definition into being attraction based. Many asexuals disagree with that definition and are pushing for it to be changed because the definition of sexual attraction (i.e. something about someone triggering the impulse to have sex with them; to find someone sexually alluring) leaves it open for people who desire sex for other reasons (i.e. cupiosexuals) to identify as asexual. It should be a desire based definition.

By "sexual intercourse" you mean any form of sex, right? Technically that's the correct use of the phrase since intercourse means interaction (and it's still used that way in France; where the word originated), but in America and perhaps Britain it typically refers to only P&V sex/ "traditional" heterosexual sex. But if you do mean only P&V sex, then no, asexuality applies to not wanting any form of sex. Someone who desires non-penetrative sex is still sexual.

[booksoversex]

Sex-favorable and sex-enjoying is the same (I guess). Sex-positive is something else, as Mysticus pointed out.

It can be confusing when people enjoy sex, some say then you're not ace at all, but that's another discussion. I think there's a difference between "like" and "enjoy". You can enjoy having a piece of cake now and then when offered, without particularly liking cake. I think if you like sex, and actively seek it out, especially outside of a relationship, then you're not ace. If you sometimes have it, and rather enjoy it while it lasts but really have no appetite for it between the few times you do it, then I think you could still be.

The point is that you don't crave sex/have an innate drive for it. Some would say not all sexuals do, either, I have friends who can go years between relationships and be completely sexless. Are they ace? Are they demi? Probably not. I discussed this with a friend of mine once, she is quite like that, so I felt comfortable discussing with her. And she was flabbergasted that I don't fantasize sexually about people. She was like "don't you ever daydream about ending up in bed with this or that person"? I just stared at her like she was mad. And she can go for loooong stretches of time without sex. Sexual people can go around not craving it all the time, either, but it's there, within them, a sort of sexual self that I think aces lack. Either way, before I lose my thread completely in this post: Asexuals who enjoy sex could go their lives not having it, as Telecaster pointed out. If left on their own, they wouldn't feel it was a problem/a loss not to have sex. They have no craving or desire for it. But if in a situation where sex is an option/offered, they might go along with it and rather enjoy it while it lasts - and afterwards, not really think much about it at all until next time (if there is a next time). If that makes any sense.

[Star Bit]

The phrase sex-favorable shouldn't be used because favorable can mean desired or prefered, and asexuals feel neither of those.

[m4rble]

I think what this thread is getting at is that there's a difference between enjoying something and craving it. You can actually see this physically because the part of your brain responsible for pleasure is different than the part of your brain responsible for craving. Mice who had the part of their brain responsible for craving destroyed would starve to death rather than seek out food, but when food was placed in their mouth they chewed it and swallowed and salivated just as much as ordinary mice. When people become more addicted to drugs the amount of pleasure they get from the drugs actually decreases but their cravings increase.

The key concept here is 'innate'. Asexuals don't have any innate drive or need for sex the way sexuals do. Some don't mind doing it for their partners' sake of to get pregnant or whatever, and maybe even enjoy it but left to themselves, they'd be fine never having sex ever again.

Velma - I'm curious. If you know you'll enjoy sex, why try to put it off? Especially as it means a lot to your husband.

I think an asexual might avoid sex even if it was pleasurable because it isn't worth the energy expended.

[Hardly any]

Orgasms are better than a kick in the pants with ice skates.

[Velma]

M4rble -- if that's the case, where were you when the OP made this thread in the first place? The very title is "Question about sex enjoying aces." Where were you leaping in to say it wasn't possible? I don't recall anyone objecting to the thread and saying it was impossible to be a sex enjoying asexual

[m4rble]

M4rble -- if that's the case, where were you when the OP made this thread in the first place? The very title is "Question about sex enjoying aces." Where were you leaping in to say it wasn't possible? I don't recall anyone objecting to the thread and saying it was impossible to be a sex enjoying asexual

I never said anyone thought it was impossible. I was just saying craving and pleasure are manifested in different parts of the brain. Neuroscience is one of my interests, learning about some of the organization of the brain helps me to understand some things I psychologically know to be true but can't fully express or visualized as distinct. If you're complaining about my response to Telecaster, I wasn't stating that you avoided sex because it required too much energy, I was just saying that an asexual might avoid sex for that reason. I have no idea why you personally do what you do unless you tell me. I'm not sure what you're objecting to me saying.

[Sisky]

Personally, I don't see why I would need sex, and if my libido acts up, it's a lot less stressfull to just quickly take care of things myself. And I dont get that emotional part of sex; it's just purely physical for me.

Physical pleasure is nice though, and with a partner you can do some things that don't really work when you're on your own. Variety is also nice sometimes.

[arthurh]

It depends on the person really. I like sex for more sensual reasons but penetration itself I find super boring. I don't see the point in going out of my way to go and have sex but if someone I was relatively close to wanted to I might be able to enjoy it as long as they are respectful of me and aren't being creepy about it.

[Cove]

As an asexual who was in a very sex-filled marriage (I only recently have started identifying as asexual) and who is sexually active with her current partner, I might be able to help explain my perspective. I can't guarantee that I'll be eloquent enough to make sense to you, but I can say that my experience is mine alone and I don't speak for anyone else or their experiences.

The physical sensations associated with the sex I've participated in are pleasurable. Fleeting, but in the moment it feels really good. That is a foundational reason why I don't avoid sex. The other reason is that I need social interaction every so often in an intimate way (be it physical, like hugging, or emotional, like conversing) as part of battling my depression and anxiety, and as a "safe" activity--one that I know the other person will enjoy and that I will enjoy to an extent as well (my "fullest potential" of enjoyment is likely different from that of non-ace people)--it's something I feel comfortable with, so I don't generally avoid it.

I can and do take care of myself. Sometimes my brain just wants that interaction with a person I trust to take care of libido issues. Do I actively seek sex out? No. There have been times in the past where I initiated sex, but that was when I didn't know I'm asexual and a lot of that was from expectations I felt. Do I tell my partner when my libido is bugging me and would like his help in taking care of it? Yes. But with my current partner only once has that led to anything sensual or sexual and that doesn't bother me. I don't expect or desire sex in a physical way. Desire for sex is almost always mental for me - detached and "logical" type thinking. "Oh, yeah, I guess it would be okay to have sex right now." or "I suppose it'd be nice if he could help me out with sex." are examples of thoughts that have run through my mind before.

I'm fine without sex. I don't need sex. If I never had sex again I'd be disappointed simply because I enjoy the physical sensations. Emotionally I don't really get much out of sex as an act, but I do get something out of making my partner feel good and appreciated. So that's another thing I'd be disappointed about losing. But other than a couple disappointments I'd be fine. Life would go on as normal. No sex? Who cares? Not me.

My desire for sex isn't based on a physical (or emotional) pull towards another person. It's all mental and calculated. It's not a need. It's just something nice to do once in awhile.

I realize a good number of people on this site don't consider me an asexual, but for me the label fits and so I'm going to use it for myself anyway. I've never experienced any kind of sexual attraction to any of my partners, and I don't anticipate that changing any time soon.

It's kind of like walking: I don't mind going for walks on my own. I'll do it. But sometimes it'd be nice to go on a small hike and have someone with me.

And this is really disjointed and for that I apologize. I'm not the best at organizing my thoughts. Sorry. :c