compson Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 A common kind of post in this forum is that someone will talk about how asexuality/aromanticism makes his/her relationship complicated. I've always found this kind of post a little bit confusing because it often seems like the poster woke up one day and realized, "Hey, I'm in a relationship, and it's complicated!," as if the relationship somehow just crept up on him/her. My question is, how does an asexual, and particularly aromantic, person find him/herself in a relationship at all in the first place? From my personal experience (28, cismale, "default heterosexual," never been in a relationship, never been in an intimate situation with anyone, never had a crush, etc.), relationships don't "just happen." Starting a romantic relationship would seem to require a huge investment of time, work, social signaling, energy, etc. In the case of transitioning from a platonic friendship, starting a romantic relationship would involve an additional layer of emotional risk as well. It seems very unlikely to me that someone would expend that kind of effort without some strong emotional driving force, which aromantic (certainly) and asexual (more complex if not aro) people would lack. For hetero cis men, this is especially true given prevailing cultural norms in the West, in which men are expected to do the chasing. So why is it that so many asexual/aromantic people (including hetero cis men) seem to be in relationships? A bit of context: I recently decided to start trying to date because it seems like a skill that's worth developing, if only to better appreciate rom com movies. From this I've learned that I have no idea what constitutes a date, what to do on a date, etc., and that my conception of what constitutes a "relationship" is pretty woolly, even. There's apparently a huge learning curve involved in this. Frankly, I'm beginning to think that starting a relationship is a lot more trouble than it's worth. Anyway, your thoughts are appreciated. Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites
deltaX Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 I'm an aromantic asexual, and I've been in a romantic relationship, so perhaps my experience might be helpful here. My relationship started before I knew about asexuality and aromanticism, so I knew of assumed I was heterosexual by default. I wasn't really interested in guys the same way other girls my age were, but I figured that getting a boyfriend was something I "had" to do at some point, so I was open to the possibility of a relationship if the oppurtunity presented itself. I kind of agree with the sentiment that relationships usually don't "just happen", but it felt like mine did. In my sophomore year of college I made friends with a freshman guy through a STEM club we were both in, and over the course of the semester he developed a crush on me. I felt affection for him as a friend, assumed it was a crush, and played along until eventually he asked if I could be his girlfriend. I said yes and the relationship continued from there. I didn't really enjoy the relationship once it because romantic, but I can't say how much of that has to do with me being romance repulsed rather than aromantic. Outside of my own experience though, I'm sure there are reasons that aromantic people might want to get into a romantic relationship, even if (unlike me) they know they are aro/ace at the time. I'll let other aros expand on this though, because I personally don't want a relationship anymore, and don't feel as qualified to talk about it. Link to post Share on other sites
Conscientious Ghost Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 How do they do that? With their hearts. All right but jokes asides, I think it's establishing what the relationship is. Going from Point A (buddies) to Point B (partners) makes sense as a transition. What makes this romantic relationship different to a platonic one? Is it kissing each other? Is it cuddling each other? Other than kissing for me, almost all of my relationships with my close friends would look like a romantic one to strangers and acquaintances. I wouldn't know other than talking about that to the person/people. Link to post Share on other sites
Qwerty321 Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 Aromantics not nessessary have a lack of "emotional drive". The only thing they don't have is a romantic attraction. So, they can still seek a relationship as a kind of emotional intimacy or something. It's complicated because they might not understand romantic desires of their partners or even be repulsed to traditional "romantic" activity. What about my personal expierence (I consider myself heterosexual aromantic), I was once in a relationship, and it was really complicated. I was asked out and decided to start those relationship mainly to have a "temporary" partner and some sexual expierence. Regarding to gender roles in a relationship, I've always thought in the USA and Western Europe they are not so sctrict as in the Eastern Europe or even more in Asia. Is it not true? Link to post Share on other sites
sophy38 Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 I completely understand your point. Some how it was my Q out of Curiosity. I'm 38 and I was never in a relationship. It's about 4 months that I know the term "Asexuality". So not being in a relationship was not out of my knowledge about asexuality! It just was in that way. PS: I'm enough nice to be attracted but my behaviors shows that I'm not interested in relationships. Link to post Share on other sites
Lord Jade Cross Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 Not now but gender roles being expanded is a fairly recent thing. And even then, many people still expect certain acts and ways of being from genders in a relationship. Regarding the question, being ace/aro doesnt necessarily mean that they are incapable of having a relationship. Lacking desire to start one can be a setback sure and there may be some discrepancies that in sexual/romantic relationships are not as common but there are plenty of people that get into the swing of things once started. Link to post Share on other sites
ace11 Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 it seems like they actually do have a tendency to "just happen", to me at least. (i'm ace, but not sure if i'm aro, definitely somewhere on that spectrum though). i think that what happens is that the other person thinks the relationship is a romantic relationship, but i don't really see it that way. and then by the time the topic actually comes up in an explicit way, they've already pretty much decided it's a romantic relationship and i just kinda go along with it....(this has not been a healthy thing for either party in my experience) Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 The way it went for me... (I'm ace by nature, and also effectively aro due to medication, and I met R., the partner I ended up with, about eight months after going on the meds) You start a friendship with them, and when the friendship grows ever closer over the course of a few months, suddenly hear the other person refer to it by partner-y terms one day. After discussing boundaries and dealbreakers, you may find yourself still compatible enough with each other to just roll with it. And in our case, it "rolled" for over six years. So, yeah... basically "it just happens". :) And sometimes, it works out, other times, it doesn't (but that's true for all relationships). Link to post Share on other sites
Star Bit Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 @Qwerty I assume by "emotional drive" you mean a desire for emotional connection. Link to post Share on other sites
Qwerty321 Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 @Star Bit, Yes. It was the answer to this: *It seems very unlikely to me that someone would expend that kind of effort without some strong emotional driving force, which aromantic (certainly) and asexual (more complex if not aro) people would lack.* Link to post Share on other sites
Star Bit Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 My experience is very similar to Delta's. Before i found out about Gray-romanticism (see A/Sexuality for more details) and asexuality, i assumed i was heterosexual. Near the end of 8th grade a guy asked me out. I had never been asked out, was flattered, and knew "everyone" was dating, so i immediately said yes and assumed feelings would develope after that. They didn't. Luckily my parents didn't approve of him/didn't want me dating and i didn't have to deal with the unreciprocation reprocussions that would've happened in the relationship. After that i started to anticipate sex when guys (and one girl) asked me out (around seven people have asked me out) so I'm not sure if that prevented me from feeling romantically about any of them; since I'm a non-compromising ace, or i genuinely wasn't interested. But i had learned my lesson from the first guy (though other asexuals/aromantics don't) and turned all of them down. (I had my first crush at 18 but she was straight and i learned about my orientation 2 years later.) Aromantics can mistake squishes, queerplatonic squishes, or other forms of attraction and agree to be in a relationship due to the assumption that it's romantic attraction. The same happens with asexuals; they may assume sexual desire will develope later or mistake other feelings for sexual attraction. I had the same question toward people who have their asexuality killing their marriage; how could they marry with such a problem in the first place. Turns out most of them had sex problems before marriage but both assumed things would change after marriage (i don't fully understand that logic, but that's what they say) or their sexual compromise capabilities dwindled with time. Link to post Share on other sites
Qwerty321 Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 I got to know the concept of romanticism and aromanticism a couple months ago. Before I perceived "traditional relationship" like a kind of "price" that should be payed for something (sexual interaction, emotional connection, etc), a kind of burden. Link to post Share on other sites
Blue Phoenix Ace Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 It happened for me mainly out of curiosity. I was 23 at the time and New Year's Day had rolled around. I always like to make goals for the year and I decided that one would be to get a girlfriend. I signed up for Match.com and went out on a few dates. Looking back on the first of those women, she wanted me to come inside after the date and she showed me her new bedspread. Oh, that's nice, I thought and then left. I know now that she was looking for some sexy times, and I was oblivious at the time. ;) I think it was about the third woman I contacted that I got real close with. It was a LDR, we lived about 75 miles apart. After just a few weeks of being together, we discussed being boyfriend and girlfriend and I said sure, why not? Up until this point, I really hadn't developed many feelings for her beyond what I might feel for a new friend. We started doing some romantic things like making out, but it always felt awkward to me. The physical sensations were nice, but it seemed like she was getting a lot more emotional benefit than me. After a couple of months, I just felt stifled. It was this strange dilemma of thinking I need to call her every two or three days and make an effort to drive to see her, and not really wanting to talk to her at all. I knew this wasn't really working out, and decided to break it off (she was not happy, that was an experience I'd rather not repeat). In summary, for me it was just a curiosity. I had completely avoided romance in high school and college, despite almost every one of my peers craving it. I thought that maybe once I was in the relationship, some switch would get flipped, and I would crave it too. But, that never happened. That was 14 years ago (wow) and up until I learned about aro/ace last year, there was always this internal struggle. How could all these romantic people telling me that a relationship is so great be wrong? Surely if I kept trying I'd be happier. I was already happy, but I thought that maybe romance would make me even happier. Since dropping that notion, I've never felt better. I hope that helps. I really resonated with your post compson. Link to post Share on other sites
compson Posted January 29, 2016 Author Share Posted January 29, 2016 Thanks for the feedback, everyone. Part of my confusion comes from the fact that the distinction between "hanging out as friends" and "being on a date" seems to have eroded in my social circles (culturally Western city-based young professional / grad student). These norms seem to be changing pretty rapidly, and appear to be hard for everyone (not just asexual/aromantic people) to keep track of. As a side note, only recently did I discover that "going on dates" and "being in a relationship" are different things -- for a long time, I thought that "being in a relationship" with someone meant that you went on "dates" with him/her. Link to post Share on other sites
Velma Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 My first asexual relationship happened by accident. It wasn't until long after it was over did I even realize that it was a special kind of relationship at all. I knew that it was very different than my other relationships, but she was a very unusual and different person so I didn't think much of it. We went to high school together, and even though she looked and behaved like the folk in my clique, she wasn't in it. In fact, I don't think she had any friends at all at school. We met because all the punk/goth/hippy/freak crowd in the city I hung out in this one neighborhood on the weekends famous for being the city's artistic community. Basically, we just roamed all over that neighborhood and there were tons of kids from all the different high schools in the area all hanging out. It was great. Most of my best high school friends went to different school --we met in the neighborhood. Anyway, that's where we met. And we clicked right away. I won't go into details because there were tons of things that led up to us going from friends to relationship partners, but we were always together-- even though she didn't get along with most of my friends (she was hard to get along with..) I'd reserve one day per weekend just with her. We'd go to all the museums, art films, concerts, picnics, camping trips -- everything. And we'd spend the night at each other's house. We'd spend hours and hours talking until dawn. Not just about personal things.. We'd make up fairy tales together and come up with inventions. And we'd do this in bed together, staring up at the ceiling or out the window. The first two times we did this, I was nervous because it was very intimate and I was afraid she'd want sex. All the stuff we did together felt like what you'd do before you started making out. I had crushes on women, so that didn't bother me. It was just that as beautiful as I thought she was, she didn't give me any "sexy" feeling at all. I was so afraid there was going to be the awkward moment where she'd try to kiss me and then she'd get angry that I led her on and we'd never hang out again. But one day, I accidentally bumped her knee and she pushed my hand away. And I thought ...wheewwwwwwww. And after that, I was totally relaxed. We had our "dates" and our time in bed for a few years. The only reason it ended was that her inability to get along with people was really getting in the way. She'd get into fights with my friends or she'd run off crying because something really minor hurt her feelings and then she'd complain that I spent too much time with my horrible friends. So it ended. I hear lots of couples break up over stuff like that. But I still think about her a lot. I think of her more than any of my "real" high school and college relationships. I tried to start up other friendships like that, but the other person would get weirded out long before the really "close friend" stuff happened. I didn't appreciate what we had while we had it. I miss her. Link to post Share on other sites
Busrider Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 I believed in being default heterosexual and had crushes on girls / seeked relationships, found a major one lasting from age 23-30. Broke up, discoivered online dating ended in another and discovered my asexuality. After breaking up. - I did a last attempt, asexuality aware but having a huge crush on that gal. It didn't work out - was LDR once again, she was apparently already disenchanted when we met the 2nd time at her place :( I guess if fate diced me together with somebody sufficiently awesome having a crush on me, I wouldn't imediately run away. Its just unlikely for me to meet such a not otherwise romaqntically occupied person I'd dare to date. Link to post Share on other sites
Velma Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 I think one problem asexuals have in relationships is that there's a wide spectrum of what sort of expectations there are about what will define the intimacy of the relationship. Other sorts of couples may disagree on how often they have sex or what sort of sex acts are kosher, but generally, both partners agree that sex is going to be on the table. For asexuals, there's a much wider set of boundaries and areas for extreme disagreement and disappointment. Even if two people sit down and officially bring it all out and say how physical, emotional and spiritual they want to get, one person may decide that they agreed to too much or too little in one of the departments. Maybe they didn't realize that they like romance more than they thought they did. Maybe they didn't realize that they weren't comfortable with as much physical intimacy as they thought they were. Other couples may disagree about whether or not they want to do specific sex acts, but they both agree pretty much that sex will happen. Asexual "sex" can mean anything between no physical contact whatsoever to anything goes except touching naughty bits. I'm very physical and sexual in some ways, but bodily fluids are icky. Kisses should be kept dry and not happen very often if at all. I could see a partner assuming that there'd be no body touching, but drooly slimy kisses were expected. So basically this partner and I had exact opposite zones of comfort and were equally grossed out by the others expectations. Also, sometimes you just change your mind due to biology or whatever. I used to have no physical urges for anything, but I'd have fun if someone else suggested it. But if they never suggested it, it would never occur to me to do it. I'm older now, and I'd just as soon not do that stuff anymore. It's not horrible, but I've got better things to do. So I could see a partner getting really disappointed if something was OK a few months ago, but not ok at all now. Maybe issues come up and neither thought to even ask the other one about it, because they didn't realize it was an issue. Let's say you and I have been together for a few months, and I feel comfortable enough to start walking around the house naked when you're around. Well, I know some of you would have a conniption fit. I'd get irritated and say I don't like wearing clothes much and I don't intend to spend the rest of my life never being able to walk around naked in my own house. But maybe we both didn't realize that the other had such an extreme opinion about nudity because it never occurred to either of us that nudity would be a point of contention. I'm not saying it's impossible. I'm just saying that there are so so many things we need to get figured out before things even begin. Other couples don't hit that awkward "eww..what are you doing?" moment until much further down the road than we do. I just think it's a bit trickier if your asexual. You can't assume anything at all. Link to post Share on other sites
Asvel Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 By complete accident. 1. We were friends, or acquaintances getting friendlier, or something. I may or may not talk about being ace/aro, depending on whether it comes up, but I'm super open about this stuff so it's a distinct possibility. 2. They open up emotionally, possibly because I'm "safe". I reciprocate to some extent, because hey, I like friends. 3. Somewhere along the line they grow feelings. I don't necessarily notice. and/or 3. I crack a dirty joke (it's hilarious) or flirt (it's also hilarious). They start looking at me differently. I don't necessarily notice. 4. The friendship, or what I think is friendship, continues to grow. I'm happy with that, why wouldn't I be? At some point, we're basically doing everything that people in relationships do. I go "wait what" but roll with it by either formalising the relationship or breaking up with them. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 As a side note, only recently did I discover that "going on dates" and "being in a relationship" are different things -- for a long time, I thought that "being in a relationship" with someone meant that you went on "dates" with him/her. Heh. I'd say it's the other way around... going on dates with someone means you're in a relationship with them. But for many (most? surely not all, though) people, the "dating" phase ends some time along the road and transforms into a "settled" phase where they kinda hang out together by default. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 For me, I become friends with a person and eventually that friendship might develop into something else. When it does, you essentially go "So... I feel romantic about you, wanna do a relationship thing?" and then you discuss what you each want and all that. The reason it's complicated if you get into one BEFORE you know you're ace/aro is the incompatibility issue. And for a long time, I didn't know asexuals existed. I thought I was just weird, broken and taking a long time to "spark" the interest in sex. Or, that maybe my mom was right and women don't really like sex much and just do it cause men do. Or, that it was just something you had to do no matter what, interested or not. "You just need to do it right/with the right person" basically is what you get told if you go to a sexual person for advice ... and since aces are such a minority, well. I got told that by a lot of people. :lol: It got complicated once I realized uh... huh. Some people just aren't into sex so all the trying in the world ain't gonna change me. Link to post Share on other sites
Blue Phoenix Ace Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 As I write this, Serran is beating Mysticus by a single post! Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 never mind, youtube doesn't want to be linked for legal issues. please delete. Link to post Share on other sites
Blue Phoenix Ace Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Oh my the tables have been turned and now Mysticus is up by 1. Link to post Share on other sites
IBendTheLine Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 For asexuality (or demisexuality, as I found that my attraction requires a bond beforehand in that regard), romance is still a thing, generally. And relationships CAN "just happen," but not frequently. Often, there is a subtle sense of communication that offers the opportunity for a relationship between two people. However, asexuals and aromantics sometimes have developed both habits and obliviousness when it comes to flirting in general, as they do not need it or don't care for most things. This includes not knowing that their actions constitute as flirting, so that's how they can end up with someone crushing hard on them. In my experience, some people just become enjoyable to be around, and if you both like each other, eventually one of you might initiate for a relationship. However, in my current one, both of us beat around the bush for two weeks before our friends accidentally set us up to watch a movie alone. Generally, though, I plan out all my moves, information, tactics, etc. if I entertain the idea of courting a girl. Liking tends to just happen. The actual relationship, not so much. Link to post Share on other sites
deltaX Posted January 31, 2016 Share Posted January 31, 2016 Thanks for the feedback, everyone. Part of my confusion comes from the fact that the distinction between "hanging out as friends" and "being on a date" seems to have eroded in my social circles (culturally Western city-based young professional / grad student). These norms seem to be changing pretty rapidly, and appear to be hard for everyone (not just asexual/aromantic people) to keep track of. As a side note, only recently did I discover that "going on dates" and "being in a relationship" are different things -- for a long time, I thought that "being in a relationship" with someone meant that you went on "dates" with him/her. Romantic attraction and relationships can be confusing, so there's no shame in being confused and asking for help. For the record, even as an aromantic asexual, I think it's really interesting to read through some of the stories on this thread and see how different people's experiences differ. I come at this issue from a very specific point of view, and it's cool to see how other aro/aces have had other experiences. Link to post Share on other sites
BlueTopaz Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 I'm actually aro/ace and in a relationship that I don't want to be in. This is my first experience even being in a relationship and I've only been dating her for a few days and I couldn't be more uncomfortable with my situation. She asked me out a few days ago and I couldn't see why I couldn't give her a chance and it really did "just happen". I think part of it was that I wanted to make sure that I didn't want a relationship, that I wasn't just making an assumption that I was aro without even trying to make things work. I know I'm probably being very selfish, but this is something that I felt I had to do to understand myself a bit better. She's very sweet and all, but I never see our relationship going anywhere. I want to give it a little more time though. If I still don't have any feelings for her after the month is over, I plan to break up with her because I don't think it's fair to keep leading her on. A lot of this is me figuring myself out. I can see other people trying out relationships in the same way I am. It is a lot about self discovery and finding out things for yourself. To be honest, though, I have never been able to lie to her. I was always up front with her from the beginning, and I think that helps a lot. I don't know if this helps at all, but I felt I should put in my piece. Link to post Share on other sites
colorsinlight Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 I got to know the concept of romanticism and aromanticism a couple months ago. Before I perceived "traditional relationship" like a kind of "price" that should be payed for something (sexual interaction, emotional connection, etc), a kind of burden. yeah... it seems like in a lot of cases it's hard to get physical touch unless you're in a sexual relationship with someone. i have often felt like sex is the price you have to pay to get that. i would like to create a situation where that is not the case. Link to post Share on other sites
ChainSmokingBob Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 I've learned that I have no idea what constitutes a date, what to do on a date, etc... There's apparently a huge learning curve involved in this. Me^99 :/ Link to post Share on other sites
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