Questions about fantasy vs reality

[Tunes]

Hey. So, it's been a really long time since I've been on here and I don't know how many of you might recognize me. I don't imagine many will. So first, a little about me. I haven't actually even thought about any of this stuff for a long time. I can't even tell you how long I've been gone. I'm not really sure. I don't remember what was actually posted before either. But here goes:

I have considered myself ase (with a possibility of demi) for quite some time. This is primarily because I have had no interest in sex - actually, I distinctly didn't want it. However, I was still very interested in people romantically and sometimes I would get fantasies that were sort of sexual in nature, maybe. But they mostly focused on connection and reciprocation, and stuff like that. I think I remember having a discussion on here about that and what category it falls under, but I really don't remember it. >< My memory is terrible in general.

So, I found myself attracted to someone. She has fairly recently expressed an interest in me as well (within the last year or so? Again with the time - it all passes so fast these days). As our relationship has grown and developed, my fantasies have taken a distinctly sexual turn. I actually get turned on by them (assuming I am fully understanding what this means) and I want to feel this way in reality as well. These fantasies are not particularly detailed - still pretty vague and revolve more around feelings than specific circumstances, though certain circumstances repeatedly show up, but either way, they have a distinct sexual aspect even emotionally, if that makes sense...

However, I have had a few chances to bring these circumstances to reality, and I have taken the chances as best as I could, but I have felt nothing. Well, not nothing - I got the warm fuzzy feeling that I get when holding hands or cuddling under the blankets to go to sleep (literally). But nothing remotely sexual. Thinking about the exact same thing afterwards - exactly the way things played out in reality - I still get turned on by the thought of it, the "fantasy", but the real thing did nothing.

I'm not particularly distressed - my partner is quite used to me having little to no desire for sex, and is ok with that. It's not something that I feel I need to bring into reality. It would be nice, I guess, but that's about as far as it goes. I've gotten used to the idea that this feeling could be a part of my relationship though, and I have been trying to figure out why I have it in my mind but not when it actually happens, even though it's the act of imagining it in reality that gets to me - if I didn't try to attach the fantasy to reality, it would not be effective (I have tried it). Yet in reality, I didn't feel anything at all. It's baffling. And even more so, when I tried to research why it is working this way or what might be causing the disconnect, google doesn't seem to acknowledge that such a situation exists.

Does anyone know why I only feel this in my mind or what's missing in reality? Or maybe whether this is just another manifestation of asexuality or if it's possible to bring it out and I'm just missing something or doing something wrong?

[Autumn Season]

Sounds like an interesting question, hopefully somebody has an answer. ^^°

[andreas1033]

Its because sex really about interconnection of energies, and, you cannot really connect in that way in real life with others.

When two people are having sex, they are in some ways coming together as one, ie an energy thing. But because for some reason asexuals do not want to bring about that connection, as like i said before i think true asexuals complete there own energies.

Its like how scots have a word for males afraid of female private parts, they call them fuds.

[Torquil]

What you describe sounds a lot like autochorissexuality.

As defined by the sex researcher Anthony Bogaert it's: "a lack of subjective sexual attraction for others and involves a 'disconnect' between an individual’s sense of self and a sexual object/target."

Some more quotes from the paper: "asexual people’s fantasies often do not involve their own identities. Also, when their fantasies involve people, these individuals are unknown to the asexual person or are fictional characters; in both cases, these individuals are not directly connected to the asexual person’s real-life identity."

"it might be argued that asexual people’s bodies (or more correctly, aspects of their nervous systems related to arousal) have a 'sexual orientation' of sorts, but they themselves, or their identities, do not"

More discussion is here: http://www.asexuality.org/en/topic/112825-autochorissexualaegosexual-heard-of-it/

The way I experience this is that my sexual feelings don't seem to belong to me. It's like some alien force taking over my body, but I can't identify those feelings with me. If I try to act on those feelings, I just get a sense of weirdness/wrongness/emptiness, which you also describe.

[demiandproud]

Hey Tunes,

Sexuality is a complex thing :) What you like in fantasy, fiction and reality can be very different. It's excellent that you're aware in changes in your train of thought as you progress in a relationship. For me, mental stimulation in general works better than the physical equivalent. Brain is the best sex organ ever.

If you'd like, and you and your partner are ready for it, perhaps you could experiment a little with that? E.g. be together sensually while you think sexual thoughts. Or share your/your partners sexual fantasies verbally while the listener tries to imagine it, rather than acting out your thoughts.

It could be more basic than that, that your increased intimacy gets tagged with sexual mental images, the way certain feelings often change into imagery in dreams. But I'd say, if you've noticed a change in yourself, it's cool to experiment with it a little, if only to discover what exactly this new thing in your mind is. But it totally depends on what you want.

Good luck, and hopefully, have fun!

[scarletlatitude]

It's okay that your feelings have changed a bit, even if only in the fantasy realm. We are human and we change over time.

It is also possible for you to fantasize about sex without actually wanting to participate in sex. I believe there is a label for it but I can't recall it right now.

[Tunes]

Its because sex really about interconnection of energies, and, you cannot really connect in that way in real life with others.

When two people are having sex, they are in some ways coming together as one, ie an energy thing. But because for some reason asexuals do not want to bring about that connection, as like i said before i think true asexuals complete there own energies.

Its like how scots have a word for males afraid of female private parts, they call them fuds.

I'm sorry, but I don't understand... Coming together as one in a symbolic way; I get that, I think. That was the first thing that I wanted - a strong emotional/spiritual bond. But sex is more physical and seems all but unrelated in this context. So... that's about where I get lost... I'm not sure I know what you mean by energies. And I have no idea what a guy being afraid of female genetalia has to do with any of this... I am definitely not afraid of my partner's body, in any way, shape, or form.

"when their fantasies involve people, these individuals are unknown to the asexual person or are fictional characters; in both cases, these individuals are not directly connected to the asexual person’s real-life identity."The way I experience this is that my sexual feelings don't seem to belong to me. It's like some alien force taking over my body, but I can't identify those feelings with me. If I try to act on those feelings, I just get a sense of weirdness/wrongness/emptiness, which you also describe.

I will look into this, because I may have some influences from it or it may involve somthing related - it does present a possibility. But what you describe here does not sound accurate because of what I have quoted above. My fantasies are very much connected to me and my identity. I tried to explain in the post, but I suppose I need to clarify. I only ever fantasize about people that I am romantically attracted to. It is always someone that I know irl and they always involve circumstances that could potentially happen irl (although some may be more or less likely than others), and often it even involves circumstances that have happened before, but I didn't feel anything at the time - only in hindsight. In fact, it must be so connected to me that I am envisioning it happening to me, in my body, as I am irl. If there is too much (I want to say any) distance between myself and the represented me in the fantasy, then it doesn't work. Like I said, I will look into it and see if it's more complicated than I'm seeing at face value, but if feeling like it isn't me or that it can't resonate with reality are core requirements, then I don't think that's what I'm looking for. Either way, thank you for the answer! ^^

If you'd like, and you and your partner are ready for it, perhaps you could experiment a little with that? E.g. be together sensually while you think sexual thoughts. Or share your/your partners sexual fantasies verbally while the listener tries to imagine it, rather than acting out your thoughts.

It could be more basic than that, that your increased intimacy gets tagged with sexual mental images, the way certain feelings often change into imagery in dreams.

- Well, thinking sexual thoughts during sensual moments (that's, like, touching intimately but not sexually, right?) doesn't generally do anything different unless I'm high (which I don't really count - drugs do weird things to people). Verbally talking about sexual fantasies isn't something she's comfortable with. Beside that, it would end up rather one-sided, as when I read this post with her, she told me that she does't get sexual fantasies at all. *shrug* But interesting thoughts.

- So, just for clarification, you think my thoughts might have gotten more sexual because my feelings increased and my mind is just trying to find a way to represent that visually?

------------------

Ok, so I think I must not have explained well. So I will give an example, if it's not tmi:

I have always gotten small flipflops in my stomach as well as a desire to act on the fantasies that I have had. But the fantasies were never sexual. Now, as my relationship has progressed, the fantasies have gotten more sexual, the feeling in my stomach has gotten stronger (I am not even comfortable calling them flip flop feelings anymore - it feels beyond butterflies, too. Like it almost hurts, but in a good way?). Also, I feel it in my chest and sometimes various other areas - usually including whatever is being stimulated/focused on mentally, often sexual areas. The desire to act on it is also still there, at least as strong as it ever was, even though it has now become sexual. One of the fantasies that I had a lot involved the circumstance of showering together. Nothing specific - each fantasy varied. The details apparently weren't the point - the consistent thing was the circumstance. Then a day or two before I posted, that happened for the first time - showering together, I mean. And it was nice. It made me happy. But I didn't get so much as a flip flop in my stomach. It's not that I was disillusioned or found it less pleasant than it was in my mind or that reality didn't feel like the fantasy - all of that felt right and seemed to match up. Many of the details also matched up surprisingly well. But the feelings (other than a vague happiness) were just... gone. They never showed up. It made me really happy to be there with her, but that's about it... And it was very disappointing - not because I want to be sexual, particularly, and it wasn't because I was unsatisfied with how it went. Just because I had expected more of a reaction, and that reaction never came. And the worst part is that I don't know why. It seems so strange that those feelings never surfaced. But I can lay down and daydream about the event - exactly the same as it happened - and all the feelings are there. But they weren't there when it was happening. That's not the first time this has happened, but it goes pretty much the same every time. Each instance individually doesn't upset me, but the fact that I repeatedly try different things and repeatedly find my reaction lacking is starting to bother me. I'm wondering if it's just something that is restricted to my mind and I should just stop trying (so I stop expecting a reaction and stop getting let down) or if there is some other approach that I should be taking to this.

[demiandproud]

The whole visualising what you're feeling is one explanation, yes, but by far not the only one. Usually what you imagine far outstrips what you want to do in reality and what's arousing in reality... that's pretty normal. I'm guessing that's what's true for you. The further suggestions were more a "exploring is cool if you feel you want to do that" list.

Mostly what I notice is that you seem to know your mind about what you feel when you're thinking about something and what you feel when something happens in reality. I think that's a really good thing to keep up.

Hope that makes sense!

[Unlabeled]

Hey. So, it's been a really long time since I've been on here and I don't know how many of you might recognize me. I don't imagine many will. So first, a little about me. I haven't actually even thought about any of this stuff for a long time. I can't even tell you how long I've been gone. I'm not really sure. I don't remember what was actually posted before either. But here goes:

I have considered myself ase (with a possibility of demi) for quite some time. This is primarily because I have had no interest in sex - actually, I distinctly didn't want it. However, I was still very interested in people romantically and sometimes I would get fantasies that were sort of sexual in nature, maybe. But they mostly focused on connection and reciprocation, and stuff like that. I think I remember having a discussion on here about that and what category it falls under, but I really don't remember it. >< My memory is terrible in general.

So, I found myself attracted to someone. She has fairly recently expressed an interest in me as well (within the last year or so? Again with the time - it all passes so fast these days). As our relationship has grown and developed, my fantasies have taken a distinctly sexual turn. I actually get turned on by them (assuming I am fully understanding what this means) and I want to feel this way in reality as well. These fantasies are not particularly detailed - still pretty vague and revolve more around feelings than specific circumstances, though certain circumstances repeatedly show up, but either way, they have a distinct sexual aspect even emotionally, if that makes sense...

However, I have had a few chances to bring these circumstances to reality, and I have taken the chances as best as I could, but I have felt nothing. Well, not nothing - I got the warm fuzzy feeling that I get when holding hands or cuddling under the blankets to go to sleep (literally). But nothing remotely sexual. Thinking about the exact same thing afterwards - exactly the way things played out in reality - I still get turned on by the thought of it, the "fantasy", but the real thing did nothing.

I'm not particularly distressed - my partner is quite used to me having little to no desire for sex, and is ok with that. It's not something that I feel I need to bring into reality. It would be nice, I guess, but that's about as far as it goes. I've gotten used to the idea that this feeling could be a part of my relationship though, and I have been trying to figure out why I have it in my mind but not when it actually happens, even though it's the act of imagining it in reality that gets to me - if I didn't try to attach the fantasy to reality, it would not be effective (I have tried it). Yet in reality, I didn't feel anything at all. It's baffling. And even more so, when I tried to research why it is working this way or what might be causing the disconnect, google doesn't seem to acknowledge that such a situation exists.

Does anyone know why I only feel this in my mind or what's missing in reality? Or maybe whether this is just another manifestation of asexuality or if it's possible to bring it out and I'm just missing something or doing something wrong?

More often than not, our fantasies are infinitely superior to any reality. I would say that while the most satisfying fantasies are the most realistic and able to be fulfilled, I make the choice to keep them as fantasies simply because I have the experience to know the reality will never compare.

When/If you both come to want things to get sexual, they will. But I like to suggest people try recapturing the way it worked when younger and just be with someone and take it slow. Holding hands, hugging hello and good-bye, an awkward kiss, and if you find yourselves alone somewhere who knows what else. As adults, we unfortunately have the option of just jumping into bed with people and think that makes everything overly complicated. When we're younger though and having those first times everything was illicit and exciting and if there was in fact mutual desire, that became apparent, but slowly. Something to be said for dating like kids who aren't supposed to be doing that sort of thing I think :) If you're 'getting away with something' it can spark desire if there's desire to be had. And approaching it that way can help us decide if it's really something we both want. Whereas simply going to bed with somoene skips over some very improtant discovery.

[scarletlatitude]

I am replying on my phone and it won't let me quote. To the OP - You are certainly not the only one. I am a lot like you. I haven't ever had a relationship that went sexual, but I feel like I would shut down if I did. I don't like touching so I can't imagine I would want any of that. What happens in your head and whay happens in real life are two different things, and that's okay.

[Torquil]

"when their fantasies involve people, these individuals are unknown to the asexual person or are fictional characters; in both cases, these individuals are not directly connected to the asexual person’s real-life identity."The way I experience this is that my sexual feelings don't seem to belong to me. It's like some alien force taking over my body, but I can't identify those feelings with me. If I try to act on those feelings, I just get a sense of weirdness/wrongness/emptiness, which you also describe.

I will look into this, because I may have some influences from it or it may involve somthing related - it does present a possibility. But what you describe here does not sound accurate because of what I have quoted above. My fantasies are very much connected to me and my identity. I tried to explain in the post, but I suppose I need to clarify. I only ever fantasize about people that I am romantically attracted to. It is always someone that I know irl and they always involve circumstances that could potentially happen irl (although some may be more or less likely than others), and often it even involves circumstances that have happened before, but I didn't feel anything at the time - only in hindsight. In fact, it must be so connected to me that I am envisioning it happening to me, in my body, as I am irl. If there is too much (I want to say any) distance between myself and the represented me in the fantasy, then it doesn't work. Like I said, I will look into it and see if it's more complicated than I'm seeing at face value, but if feeling like it isn't me or that it can't resonate with reality are core requirements, then I don't think that's what I'm looking for. Either way, thank you for the answer! ^^

You're welcome for the answer. I can also recognize what you're talking about too. I have fantasies that involve myself as well. I don't feel like autochorissexuality fits me perfectly either.

I think the insight that might remain though is that you prefer fantasy to reality for a reason. I suspect that it has a lot to with personality (I noticed your linked personality profile). We as fantasy-prone introverts put all our pleasure into our internal world. We have a great internal mental life. The problem is that everything in real life seems so boring and mundane compared to this fantasy world.

It's not that real life is actually all that disappointing, I think it's that our internal worlds are so strong that they overpower it. Most people don't have the same problem. They are more grounded in everyday experience. I think we need to recognize and appreciate that we are different.

[LadyAlnwick]

I fantasize as well, and when it comes to sexual contact, I definitely prefer fantasy to reality, and have always found the actual sex act disappointing and boring when it happens. You're definitely not alone. I don't fully understand it either but I've been this way as long as I can remember.

[HypocryteHater]

That's why I don't like physical sex ... it's like a bad copy of the mental concept. Just not the real thing for me. In my fantasies I can change perspective, the settings, the temperature, lighting, I can watch it in slow motion and replay the best parts in close up and as often as I wish.

I guess my physical senses are less developed than the average person's because I don't get pleasure from physical stuff like food or being touched by humans either, but my mind is the real thing and everything that happens there.

That slight pain in your stomach ... could you describe that as a pleasurable aching? I experience(d) that quite often when I was fantasizing about a special person, but more in my kidney area than the stomach.

[Tunes]

@demiandproud:

Yes, it does make sense. I figured that if it was normal, I'd have found more about it on google. But I guess not. I guess it's just better in my head and it will probably stay there. :) Which, like I said, isn't a problem with us, in fact it's probably simpler that way.

@Unlabeled:

I definitely agree that it should be taken that way, I guess. I mean, we have taken it slowly: it's gone this long before anything advanced anywhere. I just thought that something might have been changing. I didn't really think of myself as trying to push or rush anything. Just understand it. And I guess I got what I was looking for: sometimes it's just better mentall, and it doesn't mean anything is changing, at least least not significantly. Thank you for the reply. :)

@scarletlatitude:

I'm on my phone this time too, actually. :) Yeah, I've never had one go sexual, though I have tried in the past, in other relationships, just not this one - mainly because my partner happens to be ase. But I thought if it was showing up in my mind, it would come out eventually, so I figured I'd rather be whatever I will be than stifle it for the sake of simplicity (I got over that after denying my attraction to females for 3 years. Denial is exhausting!). But then it wasn't coming out and I got concerned. But I guess it's just the way it is, not a sign of something bigger. :)

@Torquil:

Lol. I took that quiz ages ago! XD Although I don't think I've changed that much. I keep taking the damned things as though I expect a different result, but it's always the same. Dunno why I bother. But anyway, I am definitely an introvert and I think your connection was definitely interesting. :) Thank you for sharing.

@Brian999:

I definitely get pleasure from food and touch (non sexual). But I never thought about how much I might be controlling in the fantasies. The big things, yes - locations, main actions, stuff like that. But, for example, I do know that I definitely have played around with things like where my focus is. I didn't consider how that might change on reality, where my attention isn't quite so controlled. Maybe there are other things adding to that and I just haven't noticed them yet. Either way, it definitely seems to be something that will stay mental.

Yes, I would describe it that way. But it's definitely not the kidney. At least not when it starts. If anything, I'd say it's closer to my diaphragm... Stomach, chest, and then it spreads, usually downward, sometimes other places. But the stomach/diaphragm part is the strongest. In fact, it's the fact that the sexual stuff makes the feeling around the diaphragm stronger is why I like it. Though, I'm beginning to wonder if that's not actually the feeling sexuals get...? It's by far the closest I've ever gotten to wanting sex.

@demiandproud:

Yes, it does make sense. I figured that if it was normal, I'd have found more about it on google. But I guess not. I guess it's just better in my head and it will probably stay there. :) Which, like I said, isn't a problem with us, in fact it's probably simpler that way.

@Unlabeled:

I definitely agree that it should be taken that way, I guess. I mean, we have taken it slowly: it's gone this long before anything advanced anywhere. I just thought that something might have been changing. I didn't really think of myself as trying to push or rush anything. Just understand it. And I guess I got what I was looking for: sometimes it's just better mentall, and it doesn't mean anything is changing, at least least not significantly. Thank you for the reply. :)

@scarletlatitude:

I'm on my phone this time too, actually. :) Yeah, I've never had one go sexual, though I have tried in the past, in other relationships, just not this one - mainly because my partner happens to be ase. But I thought if it was showing up in my mind, it would come out eventually, so I figured I'd rather be whatever I will be than stifle it for the sake of simplicity (I got over that after denying my attraction to females for 3 years. Denial is exhausting!). But then it wasn't coming out and I got concerned. But I guess it's just the way it is, not a sign of something bigger. :)

@Torquil:

Lol. I took that quiz ages ago! XD Although I don't think I've changed that much. I keep taking the damned things as though I expect a different result, but it's always the same. Dunno why I bother. But anyway, I am definitely an introvert and I think your connection was definitely interesting. :) Thank you for sharing.

@Brian999:

I definitely get pleasure from food and touch (non sexual). But I never thought about how much I might be controlling in the fantasies. The big things, yes - locations, main actions, stuff like that. But, for example, I do know that I definitely have played around with things like where my focus is. I didn't consider how that might change on reality, where my attention isn't quite so controlled. Maybe there are other things adding to that and I just haven't noticed them yet. Either way, it definitely seems to be something that will stay mental.

Yes, I would describe it that way. But it's definitely not the kidney. At least not when it starts. If anything, I'd say it's closer to my diaphragm... Stomach, chest, and then it spreads, usually downward, sometimes other places. But the stomach/diaphragm part is the strongest. In fact, it's the fact that the sexual stuff makes the feeling around the diaphragm stronger is why I like it. Though, I'm beginning to wonder if that's not actually the feeling sexuals get...? It's by far the closest I've ever gotten to wanting sex.

[demiandproud]

That's why I don't like physical sex ... it's like a bad copy of the mental concept. Just not the real thing for me. In my fantasies I can change perspective, the settings, the temperature, lighting, I can watch it in slow motion and replay the best parts in close up and as often as I wish.

I guess my physical senses are less developed than the average person's because I don't get pleasure from physical stuff like food or being touched by humans either, but my mind is the real thing and everything that happens there.

You could also turn that around and say you have a well-developed mind and I'd say that if your imagination is that vivid, that's awesome!

Audio-visual's pretty easy for me, but not much of a turn-on, so I have to try for the really vivid sensual ones.

Tunes, I'm glad that you've got something figured out that fits you. Thanks for letting me contribute a little in your contemplation of it. 's taught me a bit more as well.

[Tunes]

Tunes, I'm glad that you've got something figured out that fits you. Thanks for letting me contribute a little in your contemplation of it. 's taught me a bit more as well.

No problem! Thank you for contributing. XD Glad I could help you as well.

[Torquil]

That's why I don't like physical sex ... it's like a bad copy of the mental concept. Just not the real thing for me. In my fantasies I can change perspective, the settings, the temperature, lighting, I can watch it in slow motion and replay the best parts in close up and as often as I wish.

I guess my physical senses are less developed than the average person's because I don't get pleasure from physical stuff like food or being touched by humans either, but my mind is the real thing and everything that happens there.

You could also turn that around and say you have a well-developed mind and I'd say that if your imagination is that vivid, that's awesome!

Audio-visual's pretty easy for me, but not much of a turn-on, so I have to try for the really vivid sensual ones.

I also don't get pleasure from being touched; I usually dislike being touched by anyone other than close family.

I think this definitely has a connection to my asexuality. Sex is ultimately a physical act, but physical acts in general don't appeal to me. The only thing I get "turned on" by are mental visual fantasies. Those may have a sensual component, but if I try to act out that component in real life I almost always find it disappointing/uncomfortable.

[HomeBirdJen]

What you describe sounds a lot like autochorissexuality.

As defined by the sex researcher Anthony Bogaert it's: "a lack of subjective sexual attraction for others and involves a 'disconnect' between an individual’s sense of self and a sexual object/target."

Some more quotes from the paper: "asexual people’s fantasies often do not involve their own identities. Also, when their fantasies involve people, these individuals are unknown to the asexual person or are fictional characters; in both cases, these individuals are not directly connected to the asexual person’s real-life identity."

"it might be argued that asexual people’s bodies (or more correctly, aspects of their nervous systems related to arousal) have a 'sexual orientation' of sorts, but they themselves, or their identities, do not"

More discussion is here: http://www.asexuality.org/en/topic/112825-autochorissexualaegosexual-heard-of-it/

The way I experience this is that my sexual feelings don't seem to belong to me. It's like some alien force taking over my body, but I can't identify those feelings with me. If I try to act on those feelings, I just get a sense of weirdness/wrongness/emptiness, which you also describe.

THANK YOU SO SO MUCH FOR POSTING THIS.