Depersonalization Disorder

[Palovana]

Does anyone have this?

This is something I've been reading about lately. I'm currently diagnosed with Complex PTSD, but I have some symptoms that are debilitating at times that do not fall under the diagnosis for Complex PTSD (or any others, really). Given my experiences, my childhood most specifically, it makes a lot of sense. One therapist I had suggested that I might have it, but I don't know. I never saw her or any other psychologist long enough to figure it out.

Wikipedia says about it:

The core symptom of depersonalization disorder is the subjective experience of "unreality in one's sense of self", and as such there are no clinical signs. People who are diagnosed with depersonalization also experience an almost uncontrollable urge to question and think about the nature of reality and existence as well as other deeply philosophical questions.

Individuals who experience depersonalization can feel divorced from their own personal physicality by sensing their body sensations, feelings, emotions and behaviors as not belonging to the same person or identity. Also, a recognition of self breaks down (hence the name). Depersonalization can result in very high anxiety levels, which can intensify these perceptions even further.

The part in bold is extremely distressing and I spend an inordinate amount of time thinking about it. So much that I can focus on nothing else, and at times leads to vomiting, panic attacks, and seizures.

I first started dissociating when I was 13 or so, at first only a few minutes, but as it progressed it became longer and longer amounts of time. I don't know who I am, sometimes I feel like I don't actually exist or that I am an illusion, that I am nothing, that I am an animated corpse. Sometimes I feel like many different people. I have very little perception of time. I don't remember months or years. A lot of times I feel like I'm observing everything through a fog. Everything looks strange. I think things are wrong with my body. I think I am old. I think I have a terminal illness. I have horrifying images and sometimes I have these strange impulses to do something like eviscerate myself or pour hot wax into my eyes...

I know that some of these things could be psychosis instead. I have a severe mood disorder with chronic, atypical depression. My doctor gave me antipsychotics but I haven't taken them yet because I can't see him for a while and I'm a little afraid to take them right now for the first little while...

When this gets very bad, I can't sit down, I have horrifying images in my mind, I AM NOT A PERSON, nothing actually exists...it's hell, complete and utter hell. I sit in a corner and rock and cry and scream and sometimes hurt myself, I can't stand it, I feel wrong in this body, I have strange experiences that I'm not actually IN this body, I feel like I should be separate from it. I have to leave RIGHT NOW. It's a constant panic attack, a constant feeling of doom, a constant KNOWLEDGE of doom, there is no room for argument, no one can change my mind.

...

I don't want to hear "this is something you should tell your doctor", because I have, and he thinks it's dysphoric mania, but I don't think that's right! It's different. I need to see him again but I can't get an appointment! I also don't want to spark a philosophical debate. That's not what this is about. Being arrogant and trying to force one opinion or another would be inappropriate in this thread.

If anyone here has Depersonalization Disorder, can you tell me what your experiences are like? Are like what how I described myself as having? Are they different? If you have any other psychiatric condition, can you tell me what you have and if you have experiences like mine?

I'm desperate for relief, I can't live with this. I truly cannot. It will make me kill myself one day, I am certain of it...

[Sundance_]

I haven't been diagnosed with depersonalization disorder. I have been diagnosed with dysthymic depression. I've had it for 10+ years and I believe I've had the occasional episode of depersonalization during it. I've also had a few panic attacks, which sound pretty close to your description:

When this gets very bad, I can't sit down, I have horrifying images in my mind, I AM NOT A PERSON, nothing actually exists...it's hell, complete and utter hell. I sit in a corner and rock and cry and scream and sometimes hurt myself, I can't stand it, I feel wrong in this body, I have strange experiences that I'm not actually IN this body, I feel like I should be separate from it. I have to leave RIGHT NOW. It's a constant panic attack, a constant feeling of doom, a constant KNOWLEDGE of doom, there is no room for argument, no one can change my mind.

My panic attacks used drive me to pacing and hyperventilating as well, but I haven't had any in a while. I can feel them coming on and can usually calm myself down before it really hits. The feeling of doom is very familiar to me, a very heavy, deadly sort of feeling. I used to go around my house checking on everyone and everything, feeling like something very bad was about to happen.

My episodes of depersonalization are probably very minor in comparison to what most people with the disorder experience. It generally feels like I'm not really there, that there's a body going around doing things and I'm just kind of watching. I get very existential and feel very numb, like I have no feelings, but having a lot of thoughts. I cannot care about anything happening in the present, as it the present doesn't feel real. I imagine it makes me very useless and unproductive, but I can never quite remember what I was doing during those times. I think it's a coping mechanism for when I'm getting really depressed or anxious. I noticed that it happens more often when I'm trapped in an uncomfortable situation I feel like I can't change. I usually snap out of it within a few days. I already dissociate quite a bit on a daily basis, leaving my feelings behind, so that is probably the root of the problem.

[Guest]

The bolded part sure rings a bell with me. I've had a couple months at age 15, 16, where I came close to pretty hardcore solipsism (and probably was dangerously close to a full-blown psychosis; that would've made me the third psychotic in my closest family -_-)... and it's no secret that I've annoyed a good number of people in the quarter century since then with my stance that nothing can ever be truly known by humans, except that thought exists, and that at its core, everything has to be taken on blind faith alone. The most rational way of going through life is to have unwavering blind faith that is free from logical contradictions. True, objective reality isn't relevant.

And as it turned out, that's been firm enough ground for me to stand on without panicking.

I'm not sure if that counts as depersonalization... I never thought of calling it that, and anyway, I have not been diagnosed with it (as far as I know, at least... psychs never told me what exactly my "combined personality disorder" is combined of.)

[AwkwardAntelope]

Hello friend. You aren't alone. I was diagnosed 6-7 years ago with what is now known as dissociative identity disorder (which is in a similar category to depersonalisation disorder). In my case this was caused by significant and ongoing childhood trauma. I still see a therapist and probably will for the rest of my life - it has been an amazing help. Losing time is probably one of the hardest aspects for me. I don't wish to elaborate too much more in the open forum, however. If you like you may message me privately.

I would highly recommend seeing someone who specialises in this particular field. Failing that, a lot of crisis centres can refer you to counsellors/therapists who should have some experience in the area. While they won't be able to diagnose you, they should be able to assist you with some coping strategies. In my case, I was diagnosed in a hospital assessment, and after a year or so I sought the assistance of a sexual assault counsellor. She says she's seen this kind of disorder a lot in her role.

Like I said, message me if you would like to discuss further.

[SexNotHaver]

I don't have any mental health issues, but I was interested when you spoke of seizures. I have very very mild epilepsy, although I almost never have these seizures (seizure mightn't be the right word, though - episode is better). I feel odd when I get deja vu, but if I shake it off, it's OK. If I focus on the strangeness, it can lead to a fit. Sorry for going OT but your post just made me think.

[Palovana]

I don't have any mental health issues, but I was interested when you spoke of seizures. I have very very mild epilepsy, although I almost never have these seizures (seizure mightn't be the right word, though - episode is better). I feel odd when I get deja vu, but if I shake it off, it's OK. If I focus on the strangeness, it can lead to a fit. Sorry for going OT but your post just made me think.

The seizures happen more like during flashbacks or when I'm in a situation where I feel threatened or is reminiscent of the things that happened to me in the past. It's not a form of epilepsy. They're called "psychogenic" and my doctor says some people with severe PTSD have them. A lot of veterans from World War I had them. There are videos on Youtube (though I wouldn't suggest looking at them, as they're disturbing even for me to watch).

[SexNotHaver]

Oh right. I'm sorry for just assuming you had epilepsy. I I've there were non-epileptic fits but I had never heard of these psychogenic ones before.

[a_friend]

If those feelings are strong, persistent, and unavoidable, my advice would be to try to channel those thoughts of detachment into Zen meditation. The thing is, what you are describing is what buddhist monks dedicate their whole lives to achieve, but they're not afraid of it. True detachment from all that is unreal (i.e. everything you see in this world) is called reaching nirvana. Embrace that if nothing is real, then nothing cannot be at unrest. None of this life is real, and therefore none of the suffering you're experiencing has to be real.

This probably sounds farfetched but I'd give it a shot. If it doesn't help it doesn't help.

[Palovana]

Psychogenic seizures: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychogenic_non-epileptic_seizures

I've read about something called "Cotard's Delusion", which is similar to how I feel, but more extreme. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cotard_delusion

If those feelings are strong, persistent, and unavoidable, my advice would be to try to channel those thoughts of detachment into Zen meditation. The thing is, what you are describing is what buddhist monks dedicate their whole lives to achieve, but they're not afraid of it. True detachment from all that is unreal (i.e. everything you see in this world) is called reaching nirvana. Embrace that if nothing is real, then nothing cannot be at unrest. None of this life is real, and therefore none of the suffering you're experiencing has to be real.

This probably sounds farfetched but I'd give it a shot. If it doesn't help it doesn't help.

So Zen Buddhists strive to achieve disgusting mental images and eternal nothingness?

[a_friend]

Psychogenic seizures: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychogenic_non-epileptic_seizures

I've read about something called "Cotard's Delusion", which is similar to how I feel, but more extreme. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cotard_delusion

If those feelings are strong, persistent, and unavoidable, my advice would be to try to channel those thoughts of detachment into Zen meditation. The thing is, what you are describing is what buddhist monks dedicate their whole lives to achieve, but they're not afraid of it. True detachment from all that is unreal (i.e. everything you see in this world) is called reaching nirvana. Embrace that if nothing is real, then nothing cannot be at unrest. None of this life is real, and therefore none of the suffering you're experiencing has to be real.

This probably sounds farfetched but I'd give it a shot. If it doesn't help it doesn't help.

So Zen Buddhists strive to achieve disgusting mental images and eternal nothingness?

Based on my knowledge, the "disgusting" mental images are neither an inherent part of Depersonalization Disorder nor, obviously, zen meditation.

Rather, such images are a possible bi-product of an individual who is extremely anxious, among other things. Seeing those things can serve as a compulsive distraction from your feelings of anti-reality. Even if horrible, to your subconscience seeing those things might be preferable to having to confront nothing being real. My proposition was a method to take advantage of your depersonalization so that your anxiety levels don't climb to such high levels in the first place, and when you focus your mind in such a way it is more difficult for it to wander to strange graphic images.

Of course, nothing can substitute seeing a doctor, but as you said you want no such comments in this thread.

[xLiraelx]

I have depersonalization disorder, diagnosed and in recovery.

[Palovana]

I have depersonalization disorder, diagnosed and in recovery.

Do you have experiences similar to what I described? Or am I just grasping at straws?

[xLiraelx]

I first started dissociating when I was 13 or so, at first only a few minutes, but as it progressed it became longer and longer amounts of time. I don't know who I am, sometimes I feel like I don't actually exist or that I am an illusion, that I am nothing, that I am an animated corpse. Sometimes I feel like many different people. I have very little perception of time. I don't remember months or years. A lot of times I feel like I'm observing everything through a fog. Everything looks strange. I think things are wrong with my body. I think I am old. I think I have a terminal illness. I have horrifying images and sometimes I have these strange impulses to do something like eviscerate myself or pour hot wax into my eyes...

When this gets very bad, I can't sit down, I have horrifying images in my mind, I AM NOT A PERSON, nothing actually exists...it's hell, complete and utter hell. I sit in a corner and rock and cry and scream and sometimes hurt myself, I can't stand it, I feel wrong in this body, I have strange experiences that I'm not actually IN this body, I feel like I should be separate from it. I have to leave RIGHT NOW. It's a constant panic attack, a constant feeling of doom, a constant KNOWLEDGE of doom, there is no room for argument, no one can change my mind.

If anyone here has Depersonalization Disorder, can you tell me what your experiences are like? Are like what how I described myself as having? Are they different? If you have any other psychiatric condition, can you tell me what you have and if you have experiences like mine?

Time for a longer post...

First of all, I am so sorry you are going through this. Speaking as someone who has been completely swallowed up by this disorder, any length of time experiencing these symptoms is a living hell.

I also started dissociating in my teens, which began as episodic but quickly became a constant sensation of not being in my body. I have had no trauma or bad drug experience. These feelings grew and took over in college, culminating in hospitalization.

I was very preoccupied with wondering what was real, unable to do much but watch tv and try to maintain my grip on reality.

My main troubling symptoms were strange and anxiety-provoking delusions. I also believed I was a walking corpse, and I believed that I had no face (not being able to recognize your reflection as your own is a common symptom). I was very worried that everyone was staring at me all the time, and that they could tell I was dead.

The scary images I did not experience as much, but I am sure they're related to the dp. Visual symptoms are also common, though I didn't experience much except for general surreality and everything looking flat.

I have a lot of trouble focusing and feel foggy and disconnected still. I am starting to suspect that some of this is related to depression.

Once I was able to challenge my delusions and accept that I'm alive, I have stopped having obsessive thoughts for the most part, though I still have relapses and still struggle with the constant sensations of dissociation. I think that's the main hurdle, really learning to challenge your thoughts. It will get easier.

As for treatment, first of all, every doctor I've met has lacked any knowledge of this disorder, and we've had to rely on wikipedia and other online sources for any information about symptoms and treatment. I still haven't found a doctor that has really helped with the dissociation even. It's been a self-driven recovery. I diagnosed myself with this disorder when I was 17, actually, but the doctor would not even consider it. So, I am letting you know, your feelings are real and you deserve help.

As for the "zen" approach, I personally find the view that this state is enlightened to be quite naive and unhelpful. I was quite angry the first time I heard it. People who think this is a good thing have obviously not experienced the pain and isolation it has caused, or they would prefer to remain completely out of it. This is simply not a lifestyle that is compatible with reality or happiness. It tears you apart.

As for medication, if you want to go that route, they seem to be experimental. The common ones are Lamictal, and a combination of Provigil and an antidepressant. I am extremely lucky that Lamictal works for me and has taken the edge off enough that I'm fairly functional.

You will probably have to do a lot of the work yourself. Try to research online for things that speak to you, things you're willing to try, but try not to obsess about it a lot.

Never stop fighting! I'm here for you! Feel free to PM or keep talking on this thread.

[Frac]

Sounds familiar. For me, it happened during a very stressful time and after prolonged sleep deprivation. It was like an inability to identify with yourself, like you weren't really "you", just a passive observer of your own actions.

Regarding psychosis, during that time I did also have some really weird, somewhat paranoid suspicions, plus some intrusive, often violent mental images. I was never diagnosed with anything, because I didn't talk about it to anyone, and suffered through it alone. It took a pretty long time to fully recover, but I did, thankfully. At its worst, it was a mix of nothing being real, yet feeling compelled to do stupid shit like keeping a straight face and thinking up as many swear words as possible, to see if that stranger who just gave me a weird look was actually hearing my thoughts. Not even in a jokey sense, I was actually spooked people were doing shit like monitoring my internet use and whatnot. I'm still a bit of a crypto geek, just more sane about it. During a time when I was mostly getting over it, a family member of mine was diagnosed with schizophrenia. Scary to think that these two things could be related.

What helped me, was first getting rid of all the shit that was stressing me out, that is, school bullying and abuse from a toxic "friend". That, and getting to sleep and socialize more.

[a_friend]

People who think this is a good thing...

Trust me, I don't. In my honest opinion you'd need meds to fix it. I believe it's a chemical problem of such severity that mere psychotherapy wouldn't be able to do shit in the long term. In otherwords, I think it's a problem either stemming from an undiagnosed physical illness, or a chemical imbalance that can only be treated with medication.

However, treatment on either of those fronts requires going to see a doctor 90% of the time, and the poster didn't want that advice. So even though meditating is by no means a solution, it's a shallow method of intervention to attempt to temporarily lower anxiety levels when it's unbearable.

As for meds being "experimental", no matter what mental illness you have, you always have to play the pill lottery. It usually takes several experimental tries before you find something that helps, and unfortunately the ones that don't can wreak emotional havoc on you to the point that you give up before finding one that works. Neuroscience in general is a very experimental field; doctors don't even know why half of the meds out there do what they do, they just prescribe them because it seems to help some people.

[Palovana]

Thank you for your replies...

I've been doing a lot of reading. I came across this. It is me to a T and the only explanation I can find for how this is.

http://www.depersonalization.info/overview.html

Especially this, which ultimately sums up how I've been feeling:

Their poignant observations run deeper than simply thinking in circles about the nature of existence, they feel the black emptiness of existence that post World War II philosophers struggled to portray. It's what the French have come to call Le Coup de Vide - the blow of the void.

It's not just thinking about existence and life and death and meaninglessness, I feel the eternal emptiness that will be there after my death, and the eternal emptiness that was there before my birth. I can't explain it in words to people who don't understand this, it's not just thinking about it, it's not just a vague concept, I feel it, intensely, a nauseating, horrifying, suicide-inducing feeling...

Sigmund Freud said that people can't imagine what it's like to be dead because they inevitably "survive" themselves in their minds, and when we imagine dying we become an onlooker. But I do, I know what it feels like, the blackness is real and transcendent and eternal, there is no despair greater than this, it is beyond despair and if you've never felt his way, you can never understand...

[RedPanda3]

I have DPD as well, though I have more symptoms of Derealization, I believe, than Depersonalization, because I have more symptoms that relate to my senses being distorted than philosophical crisis (though I also think constantly about the nature of reality because of this). I started experiencing my symptoms around age 12/13, it was permanent, and it's stayed permanent all these years, continually getting worse (I'm now almost 24). My vision is the worst. My vision is two-dimensional, flat, far-away, blurry... I feel like I'm going blind. Nothing looks real, it looks fake, like a blurry TV screen. I feel separate from everything, just like how one feels separate from what they are watching on TV. There is that "barrier" between me and the world that I see. My sense of touch is very dulled as well. All these years, I've just been getting pulled further and further away from reality. Like I'm ghost, floating around, I don't feel attached to my body.

It's very hard for me to concentrate because of this disorder - I fade off from conversations easily, tuning people out because I live 24/7 only in my head and ghost-like state. I have trouble with my memory... I can't drive a car because of my two-dimensional vision, even have trouble crossing streets because I don't trust that I can judge how fast and far off the oncoming cars are. I have trouble walking around in public sometimes, I get light-headed, physical weakness, feeling like I'm going to collapse, and my vision feels like it slows (kinda of like when you've had a few drinks, and your vision doesn't keep up with your eye movements).

I've been to therapists and psychiatrists but never got an answer with it. A few years back I got suicidal because of this condition, which was what prompted me to see a psychiatrist for the first time. All that resulted in was me going down the rabbit hole of meds for 3 years, where the medications gave me other symptoms that I never had (caused me to have Bipolar symptoms, hospitalized twice)... eventually I got off the meds because it never helped the original condition, just stole 3 years of my life from me. I went to have an MRI to see if there was something wrong in my brain, went to the eye doctor to get my eyes checked.... no answer. It's hard not to give up hope when this condition is so permanent and unrelenting and there seems to be no cure in sight. I do have hope though and have an idea of something I want to try (though don't want to say it on the open forum).

It always pains me when I read others online that have DP or DR symptoms like this, because I know first-hand that there isn't much help from the world of psychiatry for it. It's really unknown at the moment and they don't seem to have any good treatments, they just "guess" with meds, which was a disaster in my case. Feel free to PM me if you want to talk, or want to hear about what my own current plan is for finding treatment....

[RK800]

I haven't been diagnosed with anything except severe anxiety and anorexia nervosa but I can't afford a psychiatrist so that's from my doctor.

I have major Derealization and have had it for a couple years along with mild Depersonalization and I think this was possibly caused by trauma (I could be wrong though). I feel so out of it. My dreams feel more real than reality, I feel like I'm walking through a fog or playing some sort of virtual reality game. I have a hard time relating to others most of the time as well and everyone I tell don't seem to believe me or say I just have anxiety. If I told someone half the things I thought, felt or believed now they'd think I was crazy. I have trouble focusing and I feel half-asleep all the time, I get dizzy, my heart races, my vision blurs and doctors can't find a thing wrong with me. I did take Zoloft for a while (I'm coming off it now) but all it did was make me flip back and forth between hypomanic and depressed as well as giving me head pains, auditory delusions (not often just a couple times), nightmares and numerous other problems. At this point I've just accepted the fact that I can't experience the world like others can any more, I miss it but there's nothing I can do.

Sorry for complaining.