Spectre/Ex/Machina Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 What's with the whole being both Bi and Pansexual/romantic thing??? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zapstileon Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Both? You can be both? I thought that was an 'either/or' thing. Perhaps people say they are both to be open to the possibilities if they are unsure? Like, if you haven't really met anyone who has sparked romantic attraction in you, then you don't really know so you write something like aromantic/ heteroromantic or something like that? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spectre/Ex/Machina Posted October 22, 2014 Author Share Posted October 22, 2014 Both? You can be both? I thought that was an 'either/or' thing. Perhaps people say they are both to be open to the possibilities if they are unsure? Like, if you haven't really met anyone who has sparked romantic attraction in you, then you don't really know so you write something like aromantic/ heteroromantic or something like that? There are some people who treat them like synonyms which I find problematic. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zapstileon Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Oh like that. I suppose there is a lacking clarification on the subject then. Bad awareness and education strikes again. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spectre/Ex/Machina Posted October 22, 2014 Author Share Posted October 22, 2014 Oh like that. I suppose there is a lacking clarification on the subject then. Bad awareness and education strikes again. Probably. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
knout Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Pan is bi with the addition of acknowledging the existence of more than two genders It's like bi is LGB and pan is LGBTQ+ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spectre/Ex/Machina Posted October 22, 2014 Author Share Posted October 22, 2014 Pan is bi with the addition of acknowledging the existence of more than two genders It's like bi is LGB and pan is LGBTQ+ Pan=All, it shouldn't be conflated with Bi, that confuses things. I've actually seen Pan people get mad over that. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ficulnean Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Well, some people might use pan and bi to mean I like people without gender identities, or ones which fall in the norm, but I also like traditional stuff seperately from that. I.e. it may just be a matter of how people personally relate to their own identity. Or, poor education. I'm basing my knowledge of pan on pretty much this forum, so . . . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spectre/Ex/Machina Posted October 23, 2014 Author Share Posted October 23, 2014 Well, some people might use pan and bi to mean I like people without gender identities, or ones which fall in the norm, but I also like traditional stuff seperately from that. I.e. it may just be a matter of how people personally relate to their own identity. Or, poor education. I'm basing my knowledge of pan on pretty much this forum, so . . . Iv just seen many Pansexuals get mad when they are explaining their sexuality and folks say "Aren't you just Bi". So when I see people ID as both I have a knee jerk reaction. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
insomniacat Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 So I'm a pansexual person with some opinions, and i just thought I'd ramble a little about why I'd consider myself both bi and pan~ Pansexual: being sexually attracted to all genders Bisexual (traditionally): being sexually attracted to "both" genders -or- being sexually attracted to two genders The term pansexual became more widely used as a descriptor as more and more people became aware of a gender spectrum, as opposed to the traditional binary. So, many pansexuals feel that being described as bisexual doesn't fully explain their sexuality and is also insulting for those who aren't gender binary (and thus shows the ignorance of those who claim that pan and bi are the same thing), which is where they tend to get pissed off. I get that, and they are totally allowed to feel however they want, especially when it comes to someone misconstruing their sexuality. However, I, who identified as bisexual before being aware of the term pansexual, have a slightly different way of looking at things. For me, bisexual can be acceptably construed with pansexual, because it expresses the same concept to most people, and is a jumping off point for explaining more complex ideas about gender identity to people who don't necessarily know. And, there was this article written about bisexuality potentially describing two groups, as opposed to meaning only two genders, that helped me decide that being described as bi was okay. It's late here, so I'm not going to bother with finding it now, though I might come back and link it, but the author said that you could skew bisexual as meaning "being sexually attracted to two groups of people: people who are the same gender as you, and people who are not." So, I'm totally okay with being called bi, though I will explain that I prefer pan and then proceed to tell you about the article's version of the word "bisexual.". I certainly prefer being labelled pansexual, but I'll live with bisexual. Most pansexual people don't feel this way about it, so I'll add a disclaimer that this is really only my opinion. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
WünderBâhr Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 The AVENWiki has pretty good summaries on bi-romantic/-sexual and pan-romantic/-sexual identifications. Historically, pan referenced "all". When being used for sexual/romantic orientation labels, it is often referred to with the focus being less on the gender and more on the relationship aspect. I identify as panromantic, but I don't see it in the way that I want to date every gender under the sun. With my relationships, gender isn't a factor in how I feel about my partner. To my knowledge, biromanticism and bisexuality were first used to describe romantic/sexual attractions to both male and female sexes/genders. Given the broader and growing list of identities and continued discussions, today, its use isn't limited to only the male/female genders. Of course, the reference of bi- (a prefix for "two") as a focus of one or more sexes/genders follows the term in many communities. You could probably chalk up a lot of those confusing experiences to misinformation or the lack of acknowledging that both sexuality and gender identities have expanded over the years. Similar "identities" topics may be found/discussed in The Gray Area, Sex and Related Discussions forum as well as the Romantic and Aromantic Orientations forum. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nerdperson777 Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 The way I see it, bisexual is sexual attraction to two genders, most likely male and female. Pansexual means attraction to all genders, so such a person would not care if their partner was LGBTQ, agender, from an alien species, or a piece of cheese (I just randomly thought of that). So bi is kind of a subset of pan. Everyone who's pan is also bi, but not every bi is pan. Essentially you can be both. Might be a little off-topic, but I find it hard for someone to be pangender. It's like saying they account for a new species that has its own gender while also being male, female, and whatever else in between or out there. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spectre/Ex/Machina Posted October 27, 2014 Author Share Posted October 27, 2014 The way I see it, bisexual is sexual attraction to two genders, most likely male and female. Pansexual means attraction to all genders, so such a person would not care if their partner was LGBTQ, agender, from an alien species, or a piece of cheese (I just randomly thought of that). So bi is kind of a subset of pan. Everyone who's pan is also bi, but not every bi is pan. Essentially you can be both. Might be a little off-topic, but I find it hard for someone to be pangender. It's like saying they account for a new species that has its own gender while also being male, female, and whatever else in between or out there. So you mean that pansexuals have their own umbrella like we asexuals. Pan umbrella: Pansexual, Bisexual, Polysexual ect. Just like Ace umbrella: Grey, Demi, Aromantic ect. like this? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
knout Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Pansexual means attraction to all genders, so such a person would not care if their partner was LGBTQ, agender, from an alien species, or a piece of cheese (I just randomly thought of that). Well you somewhat contradict yourself here, you say "to all genders" and then name things that are not genders but straight out not human. Pan (and bi) still refer to human beings. (Someone attracted to aliens would actually be xenosexual) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hooded_Crow Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Pan is bi with the addition of acknowledging the existence of more than two genders It's like bi is LGB and pan is LGBTQ+ Okay, here's my take on it. I use bi. Here's why. People have been coming down hard on bisexual people, saying they're "soooo binary" and I believe that's when the "pan" identity appeared. As a way to reject the binary. Thing is: bisexuality (and by extension biromanticism) is not about being attracted to people of both genders. This, from The Bisexual Agenda, shows that bisexuality actually already includes non-binary gender identities: http://www.bisexualindex.org.uk/index.php/Bisexuality#binary This is why I say I am biromantic. I can fall in love with people who are of the same gender as me, and I can fall in love with people who are not the same gender as me. I fell in love with my agendered partner. There you go :) Of course, I do not in any way hate/blame/disrespect people who'd rather use the word pan. I just don't feel like I need it because, to me, bi is already all inclusive. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Burgundy Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 From what I was aware, bisexual was being attracted to ONLY TWO genders, possibly generelly associated with cis men and cis women, whereas pansexuality was attraction to ALL genders (including trans, gender fluid, agender, etc). However, that's coming from me, a hetero, and who am I to go round telling people what their sexuality is (I'd never do that). From reading this, it seems as if I was wrong. You learn something new every day! xx Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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